RCI0 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore | cache | AfD)) RCI1 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore | cache | AfD))

Pages RCI0 and RCI1 are where users with no Javascript are directed, if they click on the Javascript-based "expand" links in their watch-lists, deletion-log etc.; and were not the "patent nonsense" claimed when they were speedied. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 16:54, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Note 1 - I refactored this to make this one request Spartaz ^Humbug! 17:50, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Note 2 - Discussion thread opened at Village pump (technical) to arrive at a solution to the Javascript problem. -- Suntag ☼ 20:12, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Note 3 - As noted below, T18073 filed. -- Suntag ☼ 16:09, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• If these were supposed to be special pages for users who click on javascript tags then I'm afraid they were in the wrong space. Mainspace is for encyclopaedia articles only. Endorse Spartaz ^Humbug! 17:50, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • And how do you propose to have people clicking on those links sent to pages in other spaces? Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:08, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Spartaz is correct here. Now, in the meantime, we shouldn't be redirecting such people to random redpages. Can someone fix this so that these are in Mediawiki space and fix whatever other default mediawiki stuff needs to be changed accordingly? JoshuaZ (talk) 18:01, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • And until it's fixed, we should present people with helpful advice, rather than a template for an inappropriate new page. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:08, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Sorry but if the interface is broken you need to go pester the devs not DRV. Spartaz ^Humbug! 18:16, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • Can someone bring this up on the Technical subsection of the village pump? This can probably get fixed simply be editing the appropriate mediawiki pages without bothering the devs. JoshuaZ (talk) 18:21, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • I'm not pestering anybody; and until this is fixed, we should...[as above]. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:31, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment - RCI0 read in its entirety:

  Wikipedia users are directed here if they try to use an "expand" link (e.g. for the "Move log", in their watch list), but have Javascript disabled. If you can, try again with Javascript enabled.

  RCI1 read in its entirety:

  Wikipedia users are directed here if they try to use an "expand" link (e.g. for the "Deletion log", in their watch list), but have Javascript disabled. If you can, try again with Javascript enabled.

  -- Suntag ☼ 18:28, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Indeed. Note that there may be other such links, which direct to these, or similar, pages. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:30, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion - Article namespace is not the place for the help messages. Perhaps you can have the users redirected to project namespace, such as in Wikipedia:RCI0 and Wikipedia:RCI1, or MediaWiki space, as in MediaWiki:RCI0 and MediaWiki:RCI1. -- Suntag ☼ 18:32, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • That might work; are redirects from one namespace to another allowed? In any case, the pages have been protected to prevent re-creation with no reason given (is this allowed?), so I can't do that. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:35, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • The goal seems to be to convey a particular help message to users who take a ceratin action. Maybe a redirect isn't the best way to do this. MediaWiki sometimes is used to provide help message. For example, the message at the top of this page provides help instructions to non admins who try to edit a protect page. Perhaps something like that can be created for the situation that you are addressing. -- Suntag ☼ 18:41, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • Any such fix will take time to arrange. Meanwhile we can help users in that circumstance immediately, at little effort and no cost, with a temporary fix comprising the above two pages. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:47, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• endorse If there is a good reason for an irregular "article" to exist in article space for technical reasons, then discuss it at the Village Pump or somewhere and get a consensus. That would protect against speedy deletion which is otherwise merited.--Scott MacDonald (talk) 18:37, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • And in the meantime..? Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 18:38, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion. Not appropriate mainspace content; if there's a bug, bugzilla is the place to go. Stifle (talk) 19:06, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • There are tickets in Bugzilla four or more years old and still unresolved, and until this is fixed, we should...[as above] Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 21:26, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Seems this is in fact a bug with a Firefox extension. I suspect that the number of people who are savvy enough to want and install that extension who would also not know why they get sent to that page on expanding a link is in the single digits. Stifle (talk) 08:14, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • What we could do is change the protection reason for the page to something helpful, which people would see when they navigate to it. Stifle (talk) 08:15, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Just because some bugs haven't been fixed doesn't mean that it should be abandoned entirely, several dozen bugs are resolved every week. Though in this case it doesn't seem to be a MediaWiki bug. Mr.Z-man 20:51, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Seems to me we might be able to fix this really easily. Anywhere know where the code that redirects users to the above pages is? 'Cuz we can just change where it points to somewhere in the Wikipedia, Help, or Special namespaces (or somewhere entirely different, just not mainspace). Or ask at WP:VPT and someone should be able to fix it. Cheers. lifebaka++ 19:12, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

←My watch-list includes this markup:

<code>
<table cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" border="0" style="background: none">
<tr><td valign="top" style="white-space: nowrap"><tt><span id="RCM0">
<a href="javascript:toggleVisibility('RCI0','RCM0','RCL0')">
<img src="/skins-1.5/common/images/Arr_r.png" width="12" height="12" alt="+" /></a>
</span>
<span id="RCL0" style="display:none">
<a href="javascript:toggleVisibility('RCI0','RCM0','RCL0')">
<img src="/skins-1.5/common/images/Arr_d.png" width="12" height="12" alt="-" /></a></span>      17:34 </tt>
</td>
<td>(<a href="/wiki/Special:Log/protect" title="Special:Log/protect">Protection log</a>)‎
<span class="changedby">[<a href="/wiki/User:Alexf" title="User:Alexf">Alexf</a>‎; 
<a href="/wiki/User:Akradecki" title="User:Akradecki">Akradecki</a>‎ (2×)]</span>
</td>
</tr>
</table>

<div id="RCI0" style="display:none;">
<table cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"  border="0" style="background: none">
<tr>
<td valign="top">
<tt>               </tt>
</td>
<td valign="top"><tt>17:34</tt>  . .
<a href="/wiki/User:Akradecki" title="User:Akradecki">Akradecki</a> (
<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Akradecki" title="User talk:Akradecki">Talk</a> |
<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Akradecki" title="Special:Contributions/Akradecki">contribs</a>) protected
<a href="/w/index.php?title=RCI1&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="RCI1 (page does not exist)">RCI1</a>
[create=sysop]  (indefinite)</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<td valign="top"><tt>               </tt></td>
<td valign="top"><tt>17:33</tt>  . .
<a href="/wiki/User:Akradecki" title="User:Akradecki">Akradecki</a> (
<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Akradecki" title="User talk:Akradecki">Talk</a> |
<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Akradecki" title="Special:Contributions/Akradecki">contribs</a>) protected
<a href="/w/index.php?title=RCI0&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="RCI0 (page does not exist)">RCI0</a>
[create=sysop]  (indefinite)</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<td valign="top"><tt>               </tt></td>
<td valign="top"><tt>01:21</tt>  . .
<a href="/wiki/User:Alexf" title="User:Alexf">Alexf</a> (
<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Alexf" title="User talk:Alexf">Talk</a> |
<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Alexf" title="Special:Contributions/Alexf">contribs</a>) protected
<a href="/wiki/John_Adams" title="John Adams">John Adams</a> [edit=autoconfirmed] (expires 00:21, 21 January 2009 (UTC))
[move=autoconfirmed] (expires 00:21, 21 January 2009 (UTC)) <span class="comment">(Excessive
<a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:VANDALISM" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:VANDALISM">vandalism</a>)</span></td>
</tr>
</table></code>

Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 21:30, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting. I don't have that. I suggest heading over to WP:VPT, someone there should be able to figure it out. Cheers. lifebaka++ 22:30, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Endorse deletion - The alleged problem cannot be reproduced in any current browser with default configuration or Javascript support disabled from the browser itself. This is related to a bug/feature in the Firefox NoScript extension, which filters Javascript out from pages and assumes that Javascript within a link target always contains a reference to a page on the server. There is no need to add more exceptions to Wikipedia:Main namespace that would only cater a minor group of editors who should already know to expect problems anyway. --Para (talk) 22:37, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion - as one of two admins who speedied these. I see no reason to have non-articles in article space. AKRadecki^Speaketh 01:21, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep deleted and add an informative deletion reason (with, if needed, a wikilink to some other page that explains the problem). Mainspace is for articles, and not bugfixes if we can avoid it. There's not enough reason to have these bugfixes in mainspace. — Gavia immer (talk) 15:34, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Restore until a good solution is actually implemented. It was deleted as "pure nonsense", which it clearly is not. Nor was this "uncontroversial maintenance". Uncontroversial maintenance if challenged by an ed in good faith is not uncontroversial, and does not fall under speedy. A discussion of how to do it best does not belong here. DGG (talk) 18:08, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion - A browser should not treat:

  <a href="javascript:toggleVisibility('RCI0','RCM0','RCL0')">
  

  as

  <a href="/wiki/RCI0">
  

• as that makes no sense at all. It seems like a problem with a Firefox extension. This code is generated from the "Enhanced recent changes" option in preferences, which states (though not very clearly) that it requires JavaScript. I don't believe that this preference defaults to "on" (if it does, then its an issue), so users would have to turn it on for this to be a problem. This is not a bug, at least not a MediaWiki one. Mr.Z-man 20:44, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion per Para. There is no need for these pages to exist in the main space just because of a misfeature in a browser's extension. The ideal fix for the problem (if there is to be one) is for someone to change that code to use onclick event handlers rather than "javascript:" URIs, for example

  <a href="#" onclick="toggleVisibility('RCI0','RCM0','RCL0')">
  

  or better yet

  <span class="jslink" onclick="toggleVisibility('RCI0','RCM0','RCL0')">
  

  (if the "jslink" class were created). Anomie⚔ 21:55, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse deletion - Wikipedia is not responsible for the minority of users who insist on using a clearly buggy browser. While defensive programming is a valid philosophy and the solution above should be implemented if technically practical, I fully agree with Mr Z-man's argument above. Happy‑melon 23:23, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Endorse. This is not our bug; therefore we should not put non-articles in the article space to address it. Though admittedly it might be worth doing something if this were an issue for those running, say, IE 7 with the default settings, but it's not. Eluchil404 (talk) 03:14, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment T18073 would resolve this issue entirely. Happy‑melon 10:48, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Overturn I don't see what the big deal here is. It might not be our bug, but no one is going to link to these pages and it might help a few people out. As long as this is only a short term solution, and something we would be able to delete in a fews, I think we should help these guys out. -- Ned Scott 05:50, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • On second thought, considering the lack of harm this would cause, I'm not convinced we would even need a deadline for this. We had shortcuts exist in the main space for a long time, and that was never really an issue. Opposing this just seems to be splitting hairs. -- Ned Scott 05:53, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • And since this is DRV, and not XfD, we should overturn simply because this was not a "patent nonsense" situation. Lets have this discussion in the proper forum. -- Ned Scott 05:57, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • Retracting per technical fix. -- Ned Scott 06:10, 26 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I'm also not sure if people here are aware that we do maintain a good number of cross-namespace redirects, despite the CSD, for a number of reasons. I'll have to dig up the examples, but it basically comes down to being able to accommodate people when the request is reasonable. People here seem to be endorsing deletion with the mindset that this isn't "our" problem, rather than if this is a reasonable request or not. -- Ned Scott 06:00, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Note - I just committed a proper fix for this in r42514. Hopefully it will go live in a few days or so. Mr.Z-man 23:17, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Fix (from r42576 and some subsequent revs) is live now. The links are no longer shown if JS is disabled. Mr.Z-man 04:17, 26 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]