The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. WP:NSPORTS for judo says automatic notability is only when he competes at the Olympics, and otherwise he should have got a non-trivial coverage in multiple reliable sources, which, as most of the participants of this discussion agree, has not been demonstrated--Ymblanter (talk) 07:24, 6 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Alain Andrianov[edit]

Alain Andrianov (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Subject hardly receives passing mentions in references. Little coverage overall. Accomplishments are also unnotable of an article. ALongStay (talk) 04:34, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. Peter Rehse (talk) 10:26, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep he passes the essay WP:MANOTE 2 time Bronze Medalist at the US National Championships. National Champion in Bulgaria. Gold Medalist in National Collegiate Judo Championships. he accomplishments are there but the coverage is weak. They seem superior to the requirements of other sports listed at WP:NSPORT 173.52.99.208 (talk) 14:54, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Strange how this IP user just so "happens" to start editing specifically on Afds created by the same user. Wouldn't anyone else agree?ALongStay (talk) 16:23, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Or it could be that the IP is a non-logged in user who has an interest in American judoka. What percentage of your AfDs have they edited on? I see nothing strange and one could ask why your most recent AfDs both target articles created by the same user. Could be a coincidence and I am willing to assume that also.Peter Rehse (talk) 16:34, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Ok PRehse maybe you are right about that IP, big emphasis on maybe, but what about this other IP vote? Another interested non-user?ALongStay (talk) 02:04, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Oh I am sure you are right ALongStay I just don't think it matters to the discussion.Peter Rehse (talk) 16:49, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

ALthough the use of puppets (sock or meat) is not allowed.Mdtemp (talk) 17:38, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Sam Sailor ^Talk! 17:38, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bulgaria-related deletion discussions. Sam Sailor ^Talk! 17:38, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. Sam Sailor ^Talk! 17:38, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete Success at the collegiate judo championships is not competing at the highest level. If we was a national champion in Bulgaria, and there doesn't appear to be independent evidence of this, it was as a junior since he and his family left there when he was 15 or 16. As far as his accomplishments being superior to those of other sports, that's not true. For example, if he was a boxer he wouldn't meet WP:NBOX as he never fought in a national championship bout. He arguably does meet WP:MANOTE, but not strongly, and there's a lack of significant coverage to show he meets WP:GNG.Papaursa (talk) 03:54, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

This link specifically states that earned Bronze in the US National Championship TWICE. [1] He is also the subject of an article in the New York Daily News [2] 173.52.99.208 (talk) 15:06, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Waiting to become a U.S. citizen does not make him notable. Papaursa (talk) 15:32, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Being covered by the 4th largest newspaper in the United States shows significant primary coverage and thus helps in his passing GNG. 173.52.99.208 (talk) 22:34, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Weak Delete No indication of success at the highest levels. National champion or third place does not speak to notability for Judo - and it is doubtful (even if it did) that he was senior national champion of Bulgaria.Peter Rehse (talk) 12:49, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Earning a medal in two nations and a collegiate medal is pretty significant. [3]. He is also the subject of an article in the New York Daily News [4] 173.52.99.208 (talk) 15:06, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Passes GNG. Competed at the highest level. Notable individual. Passes MANOTE. 98.7.109.20 (talk) 23:41, 2 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

— 98.7.109.20 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

The point is that he never did compete at the highest levels.Peter Rehse (talk) 09:29, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Would have passed WP:NTRACK, WP:NBOX, WP:NCURL, WP:NCYCLING, WP:NSKATE, WP:NGOLF, and WP:NGYMNAST. Most of which have world championships and participate in the Olympics. 173.52.99.208 (talk) 06:06, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Judo also has world championships and is in the Olympics. What is your point? He never qualified for the Olympics, and third place finishers in judo don't get Olympic spots. If he was a boxer, the closest sport of the ones you mention, he wouldn't meet WP:NBOX. I am reminded of CrazyAces489 who once claimed the U.S. military judo championships were at a higher level than the world championships and who kept repeating the same arguments over and over at AfD discussions. Papaursa (talk) 15:32, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Did you read WP:NBOX? You were the one to bring up WP:NBOX where it specifically states "Has fought, as an amateur, in the final of a national amateur championship for an International Boxing Association/Association Internationale de Boxe Amateur (AIBA) affiliated and World Amateur Boxing Championship medal winning country" - Boxing has Amateur, Olympic and Professional Leagues. Andrianov won the national championship for Bulgaria and earned 2 Bronze Medals in the United States at the National Championship. If this were figure skating it would qualify as well WP:NSKATE. Figure skating has Olympic and World Championships. It states "Won their country's senior national championships, with the exception of those countries that do not regularly send multiple skaters to the Olympic Games (consult this Olympic athlete tally to check whether the country qualifies)." If this were curling, he would qualify as well WP:NCURL. It states "Has participated in the Brier, the Tournament of Hearts or received a podium finish for another country's national championship, provided that the country has qualified a team into either the preceding or succeeding Olympics." If you look at WP:SPORTCRIT it states "A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of multiple published NY Daily News, and Black Belt Magazine [2] non-trivial[3] secondary sources which are reliable, intellectually independent,[4] and independent of the subject." 173.52.99.208 (talk) 22:34, 4 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

He wouldn't meet NBOX (if that was even applicable) because he never fought in the finals. At best he made the semi-finals.Mdtemp (talk) 17:36, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

If this were curling he would pass "Has participated in the Brier, the Tournament of Hearts or received a podium finish for another country's national championship, provided that the country has qualified a team into either the preceding or succeeding Olympics." WP:NCURL. He would pass MANOTE "Repeated medalist (as an adult black belt, i.e. 1st dan equivalent or higher rank) in another significant event; - (e.g. competitors from multiple nations or significant national tournament, not an internal school champion)" 173.52.99.208 (talk) 19:52, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete - There is not enough in-depth coverage on the individual. The person also never succeeded at a high professional level so none of his accomplishments are deserving of an article.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 06:02, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Did you read the NY Daily News Article on the individual? That was pretty in depth. Are you aware that there is no professional level in this sport? Everything is amateur. 173.52.99.208 (talk) 06:11, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

No it isn't...90% of it is about his struggle to receive papers to get into the US. Nothing relevant about that in relation to notability.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 06:14, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Apparently you didn't read the article because he was already in the United States. 19:52, 5 July 2016 (UTC)

Well I did read it and it still makes absolutely no difference. The article will be deleted because the individual is not notable. Period. You know you remind me of someone who keeps repeating irrelevant arguments at Afds. Hopefully you aren't him because he should return to his account if he wants to argue at Afds.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:11, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete There is no evidence he ever had any success competing at the highest level. A college title and perhaps a junior Bulgarian title (if he even won that) do not show he's notable. Some results and a local article saying he's trying to become a U.S. citizen (WP:NOTNEWS) do not meet WP:GNG.Mdtemp (talk) 17:36, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Junior title? Where do you base this from? Is this based on fact or an assumption? Two time bronze medalist? The Daily News isn't local, its the 4th largest newspaper in the United States. 173.52.99.208 (talk) 19:52, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I made this comment initially. Do the math. The Daily News article at the end of 1998 says he is 22 (which means he was born in 1976) and says his family left Bulgaria in 1992. That means he was 15 or 16, depending on the exact dates of his birthday and their leaving Bulgaria. He would have been at the age to compete for cadet titles. If you claim he was the senior national champion you'll need to prove it. So far no one has provided multiple independent reliable sources showing significant coverage. Papaursa (talk) 23:17, 5 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.