Trichome

Content deleted Content added
ScottishFinnishRadish (talk | contribs)
Tag: Reply
Tag: Reply
Line 111: Line 111:
*'''Endorse block''' anyway, more to the point of XRV, the user is unblocked anyway so I'm not sure what they're looking for. The block was appropriate when it was placed, even the OP ''admits it in their own successful unblock appeal'' and I respect the '''three other admins''' ({{u|331dot}}, {{u|SQL}}, {{u|NinjaRobotPirate}}) who declined their endless stream of unblock requests prior to their successful one. This request sounds like OP is still misunderstanding how Wikipedia works and seeking retribution and I strongly encourage them to [[WP:STICK|drop it]]. And for posterity, [https://imgur.com/a/VfRvrhW here] are all of NL's blocks on May 24th, none of which are IPs. [[User:Praxidicae|<span style="color: white; font-weight: bold; background: linear-gradient(red, orange, green, blue, indigo, violet)">PRAXIDICAE🌈</span>]] 18:33, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
*'''Endorse block''' anyway, more to the point of XRV, the user is unblocked anyway so I'm not sure what they're looking for. The block was appropriate when it was placed, even the OP ''admits it in their own successful unblock appeal'' and I respect the '''three other admins''' ({{u|331dot}}, {{u|SQL}}, {{u|NinjaRobotPirate}}) who declined their endless stream of unblock requests prior to their successful one. This request sounds like OP is still misunderstanding how Wikipedia works and seeking retribution and I strongly encourage them to [[WP:STICK|drop it]]. And for posterity, [https://imgur.com/a/VfRvrhW here] are all of NL's blocks on May 24th, none of which are IPs. [[User:Praxidicae|<span style="color: white; font-weight: bold; background: linear-gradient(red, orange, green, blue, indigo, violet)">PRAXIDICAE🌈</span>]] 18:33, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
*:That's about where I'm at with this. Get unblocked, immediately attack the admin that blocked you for personal attacks three months ago, despite multiple declined unblocks and saying {{tq|I would like to restate that I do not deny the personal attack towards NikolaosFanaris}} in their accepted unblock request. [[User:ScottishFinnishRadish|ScottishFinnishRadish]] ([[User talk:ScottishFinnishRadish|talk]]) 18:42, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
*:That's about where I'm at with this. Get unblocked, immediately attack the admin that blocked you for personal attacks three months ago, despite multiple declined unblocks and saying {{tq|I would like to restate that I do not deny the personal attack towards NikolaosFanaris}} in their accepted unblock request. [[User:ScottishFinnishRadish|ScottishFinnishRadish]] ([[User talk:ScottishFinnishRadish|talk]]) 18:42, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
*::[[WP:CIR|Whatever]] [[WP:NOTHERE|gets]] [[WP:IDHT|the job done]], I guess? [[User:Praxidicae|<span style="color: white; font-weight: bold; background: linear-gradient(red, orange, green, blue, indigo, violet)">PRAXIDICAE🌈</span>]] 18:44, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Revision as of 18:44, 18 August 2022

Administrative action review (XRV/AARV) determines whether use of the administrator tools or other advanced permissions is consistent with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Any action (or set of related actions) involving a tool not available to all confirmed editors—except those covered by another, more specific review process—may be submitted here for community review. The purpose of an administrative review discussion is to reach a consensus on whether a specific action was appropriate, not to assign blame. It is not the place to request comment on an editor's general conduct, to seek retribution or removal of an editor's advanced permissions, or to quibble about technicalities.

To request an administrative action review, please first read the "Purpose" section to make sure that it is in scope. Then, follow the instructions below.

Purpose

Administrative action review may be used to request review of:

  1. an administrator action
  2. an action using an advanced permission

Administrative action review should not be used:

  1. to request an appeal or review of an action with a dedicated review process
    For review of page deletions or review of deletion discussion closures, use Wikipedia:Deletion review (DRV)
    For review of page moves, use Wikipedia:Move review (MRV)
  2. to ask to remove a user's permissions:
    Permissions granted at WP:PERM may be revoked by an administrator if XRV finds them to be misused.
    Repeated or egregious misuse of permissions may form the basis of an administrators' noticeboard or incidents noticeboard report, or a request for arbitration, as appropriate.
  3. to argue technicalities and nuances (about what the optimal action would have been, for example), outside of an argument that the action was inconsistent with policy.
  4. to ask for a review of arbitration enforcement actions. Such reviews must be done at arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE"), at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN"), or directly to the Arbitration Committee at the amendment requests page ("ARCA").
  5. for urgent incidents and chronic, intractable behavioural problems; use Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents ("ANI") instead
  6. for serious, entrenched or persistent disputes and cases of rule-breaking; use Wikipedia:Arbitration ("ArbCom") instead
  7. for a block marked with any variation of {{CheckUser block}}, {{OversightBlock}}, or {{ArbComBlock}}; Contact the Arbitration Committee instead
  8. to attack other editors, cast aspersions, or make accusations of bias. Such requests may be speedily closed.

Instructions
Initiating a review

  1. Before listing a review request, try to resolve the matter by discussing it with the performer of the action.
  2. Start a new discussion by clicking the button below and filling in the preloaded template.
  3. Notify the performer of the action of the discussion.
    You must leave a notice on the editor's talk page. You may use {{subst:XRV-notice}} for this purpose.
    Use of the notification system is not sufficient.

Start a new discussion

Participating in a discussion
Any editor in good standing may request a review or participate in discussing an action being reviewed. Participation is voluntary. The goal of the discussion is to determine whether the action is consistent with Wikipedia's policies. Contributions that are off-topic may be removed by any uninvolved administrator. You may choose to lead your comment with a bold and bulleted endorse or not endorsed/overturn, though any helpful comment is welcome. Please add new comments at the bottom of the discussion.

Closing a review
Reviews can be closed by any uninvolved administrator after there has been sufficient discussion and either a consensus has been reached, or it is clear that no consensus will be reached. Do not rush to close a review: while there is no fixed minimum time, it is expected that most good faith requests for review will remain open for at least a few days.

The closer should summarize the consensus reached in the discussion and clearly state whether the action is endorsed, not endorsed, or if there is no consensus.

After a review
Any follow-up outcomes of a review are deferred to existing processes. Individual actions can be reversed by any editor with sufficient permissions. Permissions granted at WP:PERM may be revoked by an administrator.

Closed reviews will be automatically archived after a period of time. Do not archive reviews that have not been formally closed.

Dismissal of AN complaint based on undisclosed reasoning behind the block of the reporter

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Action: Blocking of User:Polycarpa aurata→ (log), accusing the user of being sock of User:World's Lamest Critic
User: Blablubbs (talk · contribs · logs) (prior discussion)

The blocked user filed a report on 4 August asking for enforcement of the topic ban Johnpacklambert had in a topic area. However, the report was dismissed as Blablubbs decided that the user was a sockpuppet of said user. Blablubbs is an admin and a clerk at SPI, but clerks do not have checkuser rights. A follow-up question by Nableezy was asked seeking justification of dismissing the AN complaint and deeming the reporter a sockpuppet, but was either ignored or not noticed.

This filing does not necessarily ask to reverse the block, but it does raise a few points about this AN procedure.

  1. The blocking admin did not present any evidence nor initiated, or participated in, a formal SPI investigation. Blablubbs has a chance to explain such behaviour and maybe his action was correct, but for now, on the surface, it differs little from being a personal attack against the user, worsened by the fact that it was supplemented by an administrative action. An SPI report was opened against the user on 27 July but no one commented there, except to state that the user was blocked. Blablubbs has experience with dealing with alleged WLC socks, but at least I'd have expected a comment on SPI or something confirming the allegations. CU checks won't hurt, too.
  2. Forum-shopping by the user is evident, yet his complaint was dismissed solely on the basis that Polycarpa was a sock (an accusation that does not appear to rely on any reasoning). That looks very much like the act of poisoning the well - sock, so whatever he says is bullshit and should not be investigated so as not to enable them. The latter part is understandable but simply because the sock breaks the rules of Wikipedia and is blocked for that doesn't mean that the accused party is automatically vindicated.
    1. Note that JPL said that: The topic ban in its imposition also admits that the exact limits can be hard to determine, and clearly says there is an option to revert inadvertent edits. I have on multiple occasions apologized for this actions... which can be alternatively read as: "I'm trying to empirically determine the limits of users'/admins' patience before they start using/requesting to use the banhammer; but admins, however much I do that, please don't ban/block me because I know I'm wrong and I apologise all the time I mess up". Some would say it is a harsh interpretation, but for me that really sounds like an admission. I mean, I hope that in that cycle there should appear that moment of "enough of those last chances", shouldn't there?

In short, I request explanation from admins involved, the evidence on which the block was made, and analyse the behaviour in relation to this incident without taking account the alleged identity of the filer. Cullen328 and Dennis Brown are pinged as admins involved in these discussions. Szmenderowiecki (talk) 09:59, 6 August 2022 (UTC) Szmenderowiecki (talk) 09:59, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Well, this is unfortunate: As I write, I am on a train and on my way to a vacation destination, so I likely won't be able to be as responsive here as I would like (and I can't use my laptop right now, so I have to keep it brief). A couple thoughts from my side:
  • I blocked as a regular admin action, before I became aware of the SPI report. It is not required that sockblocks be made through SPI.
  • I blocked Polycarpa because they are (1) a precocious new user who (2) is aggressively seeking sanctions against JPL without any significant history of prior conflict or editing interaction, (3) seems to have similarly negative feelings towards tomwsulcer (4) passionately pursues certain social wrongs and (5) shares writing style similarities. There is also some off-wiki corroboration that I am barred by policy from disclosing.
  • I had nothing to do with the AN thread or its closure, so I cannot comment on that.
  • I object to the characterisation of my block as a "personal attack".
  • I'm not sure if XRV is the best venue for this point since it doesn't seem like my block is being directly challenged – I would have appreciated if someone had reached out to me in a less stressful environment first and given me a chance to explain.
  • As mentioned above, I won't be able to be as responsive as I usually would be. My sincere apologies for that.
Thanks, --Blablubbs (talk) 10:40, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, sure. A few notes on that: I said that "on the surface", the block seemed little different from a personal attack as no explanation was provided for it (and I have seen examples of that from other users, to which I by no means compare you), but now that you have explained your motives more in detail, we have a reasonably thorough and founded explanation, so for me, there isn't an issue anymore with the lack of explanation and the possibility of it being a "personal attack". Thank you for the clarification.
I filed this report under XRV as I wanted you to explain yourself, which you've done well. I believe that "review" is about judging admin's actions, but that also means providing the chance to explain. I assumed that you have seen the AN thread (which is why the block happened in about the same time as the thread was started) but not the SPI one, which was empty for more than a week. Maybe some other users will have questions, but I no longer have any. I will no longer bother you, have a good vacation.
Now, this review request also seeks explanation for the other admins' inaction, as WP:PROJSOCK does not allow socks to be used for filing reports against users (or generally participating in internal discussions), among others, but it also does not give authorisation for admins to ignore reports based on the identity of the filer. This is why I believe that it belongs here. Szmenderowiecki (talk) 11:23, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • World's Lamest Critic was blocked for reasons that had to be oversighted, so you need to contact Arb or the Oversight team for that. I just closed a discussion, nothing more. I could say the same for Cullen328, who was handling the problem before the report was filed. As for "inaction", admin are never required to take action, period. They/we are volunteers, so no explanation is ever required as that doesn't fall under WP:ADMINACCT. I will say this, just as with ANI or any other admin board, editors are expected to FIRST go to the blocking admin's talk page and try to resolve it without dragging people to a drama board. I don't see where Szmenderowiecki attempted to find answers before dragging and pinging people here. Please follow basic procedure and at least attempt to talk to the blocking admin on their talk page next time. It is a waste of time for several people when you fail to do this first, as often, the explanation is simple and forthcoming, like in this case. Dennis Brown - 11:45, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Well, I am speaking about that precise comment, and I believe this to be enough of an inquiry to be counted as an attempt to contact the admins about what was happening. Both users have been actively editing and performing admin actions on WP since that comment on similar forums, though not specifically on AN, so while there is no certainty about having seen that comment, I cannot for sure say they haven't. I believed that that was enough, and that the comment could be ignored, but I was likely wrong about that.
    I cannot agree with the assertion that inaction is not reviewable here. For starters, administrators should justify their actions when requested. Yes, you did not use admin tools (obviously no one says that you must use them, as not all reports are actionable), but you closed the discussion as an admin with the effect that the complaint could no longer be evaluated, and will you argue this was not an action? You made a conscious decision as an admin about not doing anything about it, right?
    And please don't mistake two things. You say that as for "inaction", admin are never required to take action as we are volunteers, so no explanation is ever required. I am also a volunteer and no one can force me to write articles or to do internal maintenance work, but once I start doing that, I must do it properly. Not including some details in the articles will sooner or later be questioned, and I certainly cannot use the excuse of "I'm not required to write about that, I'm a volunteer", as that may get me reported for POV editing, for example. The same works for people with advanced rights - no one forces them to do anything, as they can retire at any moment, resign their tools, not use the tools they have been entrusted with and so on, but admins' poor judgment calls when using them (or explicitly refusing to consider to do that, as was the case here) may and will be questioned - admins are tasked with investigating conduct complaints, aren't they? Acknowledging the blocking of the OP is not an example of poor judgment, but dismissing the complaint based on this information may be, and in this case likely is. Szmenderowiecki (talk) 12:52, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Based on the usage of "you" here, I've moved this comment to be in reply to Dennis, not Spicy. @Szmenderowiecki: Feel free to move back if I'm misunderstanding. -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (she|they|xe) 16:12, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • (edit conflict) It's not clear to me exactly what is being objected to here. Socks are regularly blocked outside of SPI - there is no requirement for there to be a formal filing. The OP doesn't seem to be alleging that the block was incorrect (FWIW, I closed the SPI case - while my close was procedural, I had read through the evidence and found it reasonably convincing. If I had concerns about the block, I would have asked for clarification before closing). Or is the issue that the AN thread was closed because the reporter was blocked as a sock? As far as I can tell, the only objection to this was this comment, which didn't ping the closer, so it's not clear that they would have seen it. This filing was posted shortly after that comment was made, with no apparent attempt to discuss this with the involved admins - it seems like most of this could have been resolved with a talk page post. IMO, if a user in good standing has concerns about JPL's conduct, they should feel free to open a new thread. I don't see how closing the sock's thread is an issue. Spicy (talk) 11:55, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Endorse Closing discussions started by sockpuppets for no other reason is not fundamentally different from reverting edits by sockpuppets for no other reason, which has always been allowed. * Pppery * it has begun... 13:04, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • "...the report was dismissed as Blablubbs decided that the user was a sockpuppet of said user..." That is not correct. The root issue - JPL's edit in violation of his topic ban - had already been addressed by Cullen328, on JPL's talk page. Cullen328, after communicating with JPL and Ritchie333 (who enacted the topic ban) about the issue, and acting within the bounds of admin discretion, opted to clarify and warn rather than to block in this instance.
    At the time the WP:AN thread was closed, the only comments on it were those of the ban-evading sock, Cullen328's affirmation of his reasoning behind his handling of the situation, and a question from GoodDay (with response from JPL) followed by GoodDay's endorsement. Dennis Brown, who closed the AN thread, is an experienced admin and one of the most active in assessing and closing discussions at WP:AE. He sensibly determined that a thread opened by a ban-evading sockpuppet, in a discussion where nobody but the sock had registered a concern about the outcome, could be closed.
    If an editor in good standing has a concern about the way the situation was handled, then they can raise the issue in their own name without the taint and confusion of a sockpuppet sideshow. Wasting the time of a substantial number of editors by bringing the matter here without trying any other discussions first is poor judgement. Where is Szmenderowiecki's query on Cullen328's talk page? Or Dennis Brown's? Or Ritchie333's? Or Blablubbs'?
    This request fails the very first instruction at the top of the page: "1. Before listing a review request, try to resolve the matter by discussing it with the performer of the action." TenOfAllTrades(talk) 13:12, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • A trout for User:Szmenderowiecki for failing to carry out the first step in the instructions: Before listing a review request, try to resolve the matter by discussing it with the performer of the action. I suggest that in future requests be summarily dismissed if requesters do not show that this step has been carried out. On the substantive issues, I see nothing meritorious about this request. The block has been made, an appeal process exists. An admin dealt with the JPL incident within discretion. The closure of the AN thread was apt. -- Malcolmxl5 (talk) 15:34, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • As should be clear to everyone, I had nothing to do with the block of Polycarpa aurata, and that block was a surprise to me. When I had earlier learned that Ritchie333 did not intend to take action on the eleven day old infraction by Johnpacklambert, I decided to deal with the matter by issuing a warning and discussing his topic ban with JPL for the purpose of clarification. And that is what I did. I see no point in further discussion of this incident, but if anyone has further questions for me, I will do my best to answer. Cullen328 (talk) 15:55, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Apparently there is no enthusiasm at all to endorse this review, so this forces me to withdraw this review request. Szmenderowiecki (talk) 16:18, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

TheresNoTime's block of Bedford (self review)

Action: Indefinite block of Bedford (rationale) (log)
User: TheresNoTime (talk · contribs · logs) (prior discussion)

As I link to above, a great deal of discussion has taken place at that ANI thread as to the merits (and rationale) of my block. I clarified my position throughout this ANI thread and wholeheartedly believe it to be within policy.

The points raised by Floquenbeam as to the modifications to one of the userboxen are well received, and this imagery did indeed factor into my decision to block, though I am fairly sure I still would have blocked had I figured that out prior.

I will reiterate that although I read the thread as it was at that time, and note it in my message to the user (in an effort to give due respect to the community process taking place there), my block was an independent admin action. I fully expected the community to continue their discussions and implement a ban if consensus arose.

It is slightly disheartening to feel the need to request a review of one of your own actions, but I do try to take the expectation of accountability seriously. Although any administrator is currently free to undo my block, this seems the most transparent way of resolving this.

Lastly, I'd ask that those commenting here firmly stick to the issues at hand (i.e. should this block remain? / should this block have been made?). Many thanks. — TheresNoTime (talk • she/her) 13:18, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I would simply recommend unblocking @Bedford: & leave his Wiki-fate, in the hands of the community at WP:ANI. GoodDay (talk) 13:27, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
For the benefit of everyone who might have had difficulty following the back-and-forth in the original ANI thread, could you please summarize why you believe the indef block was within policy grounds - excluding essays such as WP:NOTHERE and WP:NONAZIS? I know this is redundant, but perhaps seeing a brief summary would help to assuage concerns that I raised in the ANI thread of this being a "cathartic" block.--🌈WaltCip-(talk) 13:30, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, though I'm just really repeating those essays — my block of Bedford was for editing Wikipedia with outwardly visible hostile beliefs (contrary to WP:5P4, our civility policy, WP:NPOV and WP:NOT) and adding and maintaining the inclusion of disruptive and hateful content to their user pages (WP:NOT, namely not a web host, advocacy and again our civility policy). Wikipedia is not the place to "carry on ideological battles, or nurture prejudice, hatred, or fear." — TheresNoTime (talk • she/her) 13:58, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
So technically I think you're right, which as far as I understand, is the only thing that AARV/XRV attempts to fact-find. The issue I have with it is that of timing, as GabberFlasted pointed out below. Still, I don't know if there's ever a good time to impose a block such as this for the reasons that are given. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 14:33, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I support the block, the reasoning provided was questionable but Bedford came out of retirement for the sole purpose of trolling. Obviously WP:NOTHERE behavior, block should stay. Dronebogus (talk) 13:33, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Question Were you aware of the ANI thread when you made the block? Please don't read this in an edit* harshly interrogative tone. GabberFlasted (talk) 13:35, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes – see above; "I will reiterate that although I read the thread as it was at that time, and note it in my message to the user [...]" — TheresNoTime (talk • she/her) 13:59, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    trout Self-trout Thank you, please excuse the redundant request for reiterated reiterations. GabberFlasted (talk) 14:01, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Judging by the general world view of Bedford, their recent activities, attitude towards other editors, and what I saw about their activities in the past, I can say that I fully support the action of TheresNoTime. The block certainly should stay. —Sundostund (talk) 14:07, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I would tokenly not endorse this block, because of the intersection of
  • The ANI thread that was actively discussing a then-implicit CBAN
  • Bedford did not pose an immediate threat of disruption.
  • The extent of Bedford's extreme views became a centralized part of those calling for a block/ban.
Had any of these elements been absent, I think the block would have been fine, or even ideal. But because of the coincidence of these three, it appears as though this block was done to rapidly suppress someone because of their views, and this feeds the fires of people who decry the current administration as $buzzword. I believe in a short time, Bedford will be CBAN'd, and the timing of the block will prove wholly inconsequential. I know my take smells a bit like PR and expect that it won't sit well with most. I only bring this all up because comment was requested, and please let me know if this post is inappropriate in any way.
TL:DR, if pressed I would probably accept that the block was safely rooted in policy, but wasn't necessary and had an avoidable negative appearance because of the circumstances.GabberFlasted (talk) 14:29, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I opposed a block in that discussion, and now finding out someone else added that symbol to his page, that is reinforced. Unquestionably, you made a call in good faith, but I think it was a mistake. I've done the same quite recently with a block in the PI area (may still be on ANI) and I just quickly reverted after several complained. I think the problem here (as with my mistaken block) is a lot of knee jerk reaction by a lot of people, including many that are !voting on the issue at the page. It becomes very dangerous when we block for what people think instead of what they do, and should be avoided under almost all circumstances. Dennis Brown - 14:33, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Point of order: Isn't this 'review' premature, given that there is still an ongoing AN/I discussion (only a day-and-a-half old)? I can see we're already getting a reiteration of points being made and discussed in that still-open thread. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 14:37, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The review is intended to separate the discussion of whether the indef block was valid under policy in a vacuum, vs the discussion of whether a CBAN is necessary for Bedford regardless of the imposition of an indef block. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 14:44, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
In my opinion, that ANI thread should remain on the topic initially raised (which I suppose now is working it's way towards finding consensus wrt. a CBAN?) — my block impacts that discussion and is relevant in that thread, but me barging in and requesting self-review will further derail things, and means that wider participation is unlikely to take place. At least here people may be able to view the situation with a "fresh pair of eyes", which is certainly appreciated. — TheresNoTime (talk • she/her) 14:44, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I would argue that the AN/I discussion also addresses the question of the validity of the indef block, though. (And indeed, several participants have touched on that issue specifically, in addition to weighing in on the ban.)
The AN/I discussion may also incidentally surface relevant user conduct behavior or investigative steps that may be relevant to when/how/why a block - independent of the CBAN - would or would not be valid. Indeed, Dennis Brown above touches on some of exactly that sort of information (though I disagree with his conclusion).
Instead, we're reduplicating and fragmenting that effort and information in this location. There was no reason - other than TheresNoTime's burning curiosity - to begin this review while the AN/I discussion is ongoing and tempers are up. If there remain open questions about the validity of TheresNoTime's block after the AN/I discussion is closed, then it might make sense to start a review here. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 15:02, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the comments — I remain of the opinion that a fragmentation of the discussion between ANI (reported user conduct, community consensus over lasting block/ban) and here (a review of the admin actions I have taken in relation to this user) makes sense, but I could certainly be wrong. This review is meant to stay open a while, but bureaucracy for bureaucracies’ sake is a waste of everyone's time — if, as an uninvolved admin, you (or anyone else) would like to close this review early please feel free to — TheresNoTime (talk • she/her) 15:24, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
As one of the editors who has raised this point in the ANI, I would like to point out that I felt the block, while inevitable, completely disregarded the community discussion on the CBAN, but then used that discission to indef. Pretty much the entire ANI agrees there wasn't enough RECENT to warrant an indef, the discussion was including a totality of conduct throughout the life on the project, meaning the indef appears to be related to the discussion. The admin states they made the block outside of the ANI, despite admitting being aware of the ANI before the block, and likely ONLY being aware of the issue because of the ANI(if this is incorrect, let me know, I will retract). It was premature, and circumvented the community CBAN discussion.
WP:CBAN clearly says that when a site ban is up for discussion, which it was, since TAOT posted the proposal to indef, the discussion should remain open for 72 hours, unless consensus is clear after 24 hours. To indef the user for their conduct, while the community is discussing whether or not their conduct is worth indeffing (with absolutely no clear consensus for the indef, BTW), was the incorrect choice, in my opinion.
With all that said, the block was inevitable, and while I firmly support TNT in their decision for self review, I feel it is unnecessary, since, let's face it, it's still ultimately a block of someone who appeared headed for a CBAN anyway. FrederalBacon (talk) 20:04, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • It is what it is. I think the admin action was a bit too pre-emptive, as I would rather have had the result of the ANI discussion determine the result, but at the end of the day I'm not gonna cry about a neo-Confederate getting blocked. It is also important to note that the community can still institute a CBAN (or choose not to) on top of the normal block, so the community still has a choice. Curbon7 (talk) 20:06, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    The consensus is leaning CBAN Dronebogus (talk) 00:32, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Current !vote count is 25 supporting indef/CBAN, 23 opposing. I don't know if I'd call that consensus. FrederalBacon (talk) 20:32, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Regarding blocking an editor during an ongoing discussion about their behaviour: this has happened in the past. Most prominently in recent history, a party to an arbitration case was blocked prior to the case closing. Administrators have different thresholds for acting, and one can fairly decide that policy has been significantly breached in their judgement to warrant a block. This does not pre-empt the ability of the community to enact more severe sanctions, should it feel them to be necessary. isaacl (talk) 20:29, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • TheresNoTime needs to slow down - TheresNoTime's username is ironic; there is actually plenty of time. Firstly, the ANI thread was still active at the time of the block, and Bedford was not causing any immediate harm to the project (apart from calling someone "childish" and "ignorant", which, let's face it, happens on an hourly basis here), so the block should have waited until the ANI thread was closed and consensus was determined. Secondly, the ANI thread is still ongoing and already has 100KB of discussion, so why are we starting another parallel discussion here? Just slow down, maybe ease up on the coffee, there's no rush and no reason to make panicked decisions. I'd recommend closing this thread and allowing the ANI thread to come to a natural conclusion. If there's consensus to block, then the block can remain in place. If there isn't, then the block can be lifted. Nothing positive will result from fracturing the discussion in multiple venues. —⁠ScottyWong⁠— 20:59, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Block was good, block should stay; thanks. --JBL (talk) 00:17, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Administrator immediately resorting to indefinite IP block

Action: On the 24th of May 2022, user The Blade of the Northern Lights proceeded to implement an indefinite block of both my user account and my IP, going against Blocking Policy which asserts that "IP addresses should almost never be indefinitely blocked".
User: The Blade of the Northern Lights (talk · contribs · logs) ([[No discussion took place as, while my unblocking review process went on for more than 2 months and The Blade of the Northern Lights was involved in it, they maintained the block.|prior discussion]])

I am requesting this action by The Blade of the Northern Lights be reviewed as it goes against Blocking Policy recommendations and produced great levels of wasted time, both on my end, and of multiple other admins, in trying to revert that indefinite IP block. Personally, I believe that admins have an immense responsibility towards the community and them functioning against policy recommendations without any explanations as to why, can incur great costs to the project in the long run. ==Notice of noticeboard discussion== Information icon There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrative action review regarding an action which you performed. The thread is Administrator immediately resorting to indefinite IP block. Thank you. CarpathianAlien (talk) 18:18, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Per the giant notice in bold at the top of this page: You must leave a notice on the editor's talk page. You may use {{XRV-notice}} for this purpose. but I've gone ahead and done that for you since you don't appear to have done so yourself. PRAXIDICAE🌈 18:23, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I see no evidence that TBotNL has indeffed any IPs in May or in the last year. Also there are some blatant untruths here. First, NL did engage with you when they stated they would watch the page and would leave explicit discretion to the reviewing admin, which is exactly what they did. Generally admins placing the block do not assess unblock requests, and certainly don't decline them. PRAXIDICAE🌈 18:25, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Endorse block anyway, more to the point of XRV, the user is unblocked anyway so I'm not sure what they're looking for. The block was appropriate when it was placed, even the OP admits it in their own successful unblock appeal and I respect the three other admins (331dot, SQL, NinjaRobotPirate) who declined their endless stream of unblock requests prior to their successful one. This request sounds like OP is still misunderstanding how Wikipedia works and seeking retribution and I strongly encourage them to drop it. And for posterity, here are all of NL's blocks on May 24th, none of which are IPs. PRAXIDICAE🌈 18:33, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    That's about where I'm at with this. Get unblocked, immediately attack the admin that blocked you for personal attacks three months ago, despite multiple declined unblocks and saying I would like to restate that I do not deny the personal attack towards NikolaosFanaris in their accepted unblock request. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:42, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Whatever gets the job done, I guess? PRAXIDICAE🌈 18:44, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Leave a Reply