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Trains: in Germany Start‑class Low‑importance

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Harz Narrow Gauge Railways → Harz narrow-gauge railways – The topic of the article seems to be more about the railway lines themselves than about their operating company Harzer Schmalspurbahnen GmbH (HSB), which translates to the current proper-name page title. The lead and history sections distinguish the lines and line network from the companies, and while the article has some coverage of the company, it is not the main topic. As the company site says, "We, the Harz Narrow Gauge Railways, are one of the world's last great steam adventures, with 25 steam locomotives. ..." and "Europe’s most powerful narrow-gauge steam locomotives" and "Things you can’t experience on any other narrow-gauge steam railway", while the article is about "a network of metre-gauge railways in the Harz mountains" that "connects the principal towns of Wernigerode, Nordhausen and Quedlinburg and several smaller towns in the area with about 140 kilometres of track, much of which is steeply graded and picturesque", which is "currently operated by the Harzer Schmalspurbahnen GmbH". Let's decide the topic, and name it accordingly. Dicklyon (talk) 04:22, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Support as nom – Note that the cited book Walking in the Harz Mountains: Including Walks from the Harz Narrow Gauge Railway doesn't use the present title except as part of the book title, and the caps are because book titles are in title case. Inside, it uses "narrow gauge" lowercase in various ways in the talking about this "railway network through the Harz Mountains". And this page talks of "Germany's largest network of narrow-gauge railways. These antique steam engines chug up and over the mountains, connecting the little villages of the Harz." And this page mixes things up with "enjoy a trip on the Harz narrow-gauge Railway". And this one "Such terrain is ideally suited to narrow-gauge railways and a network was built in the pioneering days of the railway. Today the Harz Mountains system offers a wonderful public transport service and steam-hauled tourist trains with beautifully restored vintage rolling stock." The caps version is also common in sources, but if the topic is the network of narrow-guage lines, then we ought to use an appropriate descriptive title, not the name of the operating company instead. Dicklyon (talk) 04:37, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. The present title is the official name of the company on their website. It's a proper name and it's not hyphenated. Nor does hyphenating the name, which I suspect is the nom's real aim if you look at his recent edits, reflect English sources which often do not hyphenate "narrow gauge". --Bermicourt (talk) 08:36, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You seem to have mis-read the nomination. The question is whether to name the article for the company, versus for the rail network itself. Yes, I stipulate that the current title is correct if we want it to be about the company. Furthermore, hyphens are seldom used in proper names, I agree. Can you consider the question? Dicklyon (talk) 19:07, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose Just because you've just avoided a TBAN for these moves because the ANI thread was archived without action does NOT mean that there is support for your mindless imposition of a styleguide over the established names of external bodies. Andy Dingley (talk) 10:55, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

As far as I know, nobody has suggested a TBAN, nor any restriction on opening Requested Move discussions. I'm following up on your suggestion to discuss such things on a case by case basis. Please review the question, which is not about style issues, but about whether to title the article for the operating company or for the rail network itself. The article and sources make a distinction between these things. Before Bermicourt moved it in 2009, the title was the German Harzer Schmalspurbahnen, which could have been interpreted as the generic, or as the company name Harzer Schmalspurbahnen GmbH; he made a call, which is great, but I think it was not the best call. Dicklyon (talk) 19:23, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ah I now see the confusion. The opening sentence of the German Wiki article from which this was translated is: "Die Harzer Schmalspurbahnen GmbH (HSB) mit Sitz in Wernigerode ist eine Eisenbahngesellschaft, die ein zirka 140 km langes Netz von zumeist dampfbetriebenen Schmalspurstrecken im Harz betreibt." In other words "The Harz Narrow Gauge Railways" (HSB) is a railway company with its head office in Wernigerode that operates a railway network some 140 km long of mainly steam-operated narrow gauge lines in the Harz Mountains." If we reword the opening sentence here, it will more accurately reflect that. Bermicourt (talk) 19:53, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, if we decide to title the article for the company, we should make the lede reflect that. I'm proposing going the other way, and keep it about the narrow-gauge rail lines themselves. Dicklyon (talk) 20:02, 14 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• I believe the article should be about the railways themselves, as the main point of interest, with information about the operating company ancillary to that. TobyJ (talk) 18:01, 15 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]