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Technology Start‑class

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I've added two more sources. So now it has citations to independent articles from Dr. Dobbs Journal, LWN.net, itWorld and tvTelecom, along with one other independent cite. They were described by one helpful person on #wikipedia-en-help as 4 "gold-standard-in-depth-sources". They span a period of 9 months. I think that qualifies as wp:notability ★NealMcB★ (talk) 19:05, 20 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

It's a bit small, I'm not sure if there is anything that can be done to make it a bit bigger so it fills out the box? 185.112.0.202 (talk) 10:51, 7 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I re-uploaded the logo in vectorial format acquired from Matrix.org's Github Page, size set to 220px, which I think is a sensible size. Daimond (talk) 22:11, 10 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I've added some information about matrix.org's recent breach. While it isn't related to the protocol itself, I think it's worth mentioning as this does affect the matrix ecosystem as a whole.
On a more general note, should information about matrix.org be posted here? I don't think matrix.org is notable enough to receive its own page. GautamC129 (talk) 02:22, 13 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

AFAIK putting information about the matrix.org breach here is like putting information about the breach of Hilary Clinton's mailserver on the Wikipedia pages about email. I'd say it's out of scope, as the vulnerability that allowed the breach had nothing to do with the Matrix protocol itself. I agree that matrix.org probably isn't notable enough to have it's own page, but information about it is probably better on a page about the New Vector company that runs matrix.org, or perhaps a page about the Matrix Foundation that steward the protocol. --Danylstrype (talk) 12:22, 22 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm concerned that the current text on this page confuses the Matrix protocol (the topic of the page), and various integrations that the Riot app (the flagship app using Matrix) has with other systems that are not part of the Matrix protocol. For example, Riot integrates with Jitsi Meet to provide audio/ video conferencing, and JM does use WebRTC, but AFAIK WebRTC is not part of the Matrix protocol itself. --Danylstrype (talk) 12:33, 22 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Matrix does use WebRTC for 1:1 VoIP/Video calling. Source: https://matrix.org/docs/spec/client_server/r0.6.1#voice-over-ip Marviiin (talk) 22:11, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Marviiin wanted to remove the stylized [matrix] from the lede, but due to apparent conflict of interest I thought this could use discussion. I see File:Matrix logo.svg uses this stylization. With a quick web search, heiCHAT (Heidelberg University) uses this stylization. I recall seeing the brackets associated elsewhere too, but don't have references available right now. Per MOS:TMSTYLE, I think it's appropriate to keep the stylized version. 84.250.17.211 (talk) 20:20, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

So, I appreciate I'm a primary source here and thus conflicted, but if you look at the entirety matrix.org site and the vast majority of projects which build on the protocol, they refer to the protocol as Matrix in writing. People sometimes get confused because the logo of the project (i.e. the SVG) happens to have square brackets around the word matrix, but this is just cosmetics - it's *not* the name of the project. Just as you wouldn't try to render their logos of any other companies in unicode (e.g. you wouldn't refer to Apple Inc as  in writing, or Microsoft as ⊞Microsoft). For instance, https://matrix.org/blog/2020/06/16/matrix-decomposition-an-independent-academic-analysis-of-matrix-state-resolution describes an academic paper written about Matrix (which happened to originally get it wrong and use [matrix] to try to disambiguate from the mathematical term Matrix - but was thankfully corrected before it went to press). Marviiin (talk) 21:42, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In practice (a quick search on this wiki), there are articles such as McMillions (stylized as McMillion$), Positiv (stylized as POSITiV), Snow (app) (stylized as SNOW), Razer Inc. (stylized as R Λ Z Ξ R), VG247 (stylized as VG24/7), etc. Many of these stylized names come from the logoface, even if the official website refers to them by the unstylized name. 84.250.17.211 (talk) 01:44, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

To me it looks like a wider issue. No one really uses stylized names. Imho this is the reason to drop it even in articles that have them. Take Razer for example. It's logo is a graphic image so any attempt to translate it into unicode symbols is a WP:OR – I haven't found a source to stylization on any of linked articles (except for capitalization maybe). We have a similar situation here. I'm strongly in favor of dropping the stylization, as it's either not notable or even original research. – K4rolB (talk) 16:02, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think having a transcript of the text in an logo is useful for accessibility (if the transcription is possible: Using Greek letters such as Λ Ξ because their glyphs look like the stylized Latin letters in File:Razer wordmark.svg is a hack and it is not clear whether to use Ʌ or Λ. See also: c:Category:Unusual_letterforms). But this information does not belong in the article if the stylized text is not used in writings. In these cases, transcripts should be added as inscription (P1684) c:Commons:Statements and stylized texts removed from the articles. —Dexxor (talk) 09:13, 24 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Additionally, something like Slack (software) doesn't currently mention a stylized name, but the logoface is lowercase slack. 84.250.17.211 (talk) 02:08, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps a solution could be to say "sometimes incorrectly stylised as [matrix]"? Marviiin (talk) 22:12, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I don't believe the stylization to be "incorrect", unless there's a reliable non-primary source stating otherwise. (See also my comment above.) 84.250.17.211 (talk) 01:47, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If you look at every single non-primary source in the Matrix ecosystem - e.g. every(?) independent project linked from https://matrix.org/docs/projects/try-matrix-now/, you will see that the project is referred to as Matrix. Just because Heidelberg were ill-informed and got it wrong doesn't mean that Wikipedia should perpetuate the bug by the very first sentence of the Wikipedia page enshrining the error :) Marviiin (talk) 09:07, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• riot-web/res/welcome.html (v1.7.1) [matrix]
• riot-web/src/i18n/strings/en_US.json (v1.7.1) [matrix]
• Capitalize and fix [matrix] committed by TheEvilSkeleton on Jul 17, 2020
• Revert "[matrix]" to "Matrix" committed by TheEvilSkeleton on Jul 20, 2020

No consensus, from the latest Element release. 84.250.17.211 (talk) 21:32, 24 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No, there is perfect consensus. The bad commit you linked to was never merged, caught in review, and subsequently reverted, as per https://github.com/vector-im/riot-web/pull/14566#pullrequestreview-451610320. Meanwhile, the "[matrix]" in welcome.html and the matching i18n is a magic constant which is never shown to the user, which is interpolated to be the actual matrix logo SVG + hyperlink, as you can see if you go to https://app.element.io as a new user. The code for this is at https://github.com/vector-im/riot-web/blob/ffab08bd60be34dd34cd0db7c0aa6eca986ce52e/src/components/structures/VectorEmbeddedPage.js#L32. 92.234.32.44 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:43, 24 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

VectorEmbeddedPage.js seems to display alt text [matrix], even if what you said is true. I see that's also the case on the Element page you linked to. And yes, I linked to both commits appropriately; thanks for finding and linking to a pull request. The Git log graph actually looks like so:

*   264bce7c Merge branch 'tmp1' into develop
|\
| * 0ada7b5d Update i18n
| * 3e37f21e Revert "[matrix]" to "Matrix"
| * 96f0d3a0 Capitalize and fix [matrix]
[...]
|/ /
* |   398033e7 Merge pull request #14572 from vector-im/t3chguy/devdep
* |   398033e7 Merge pull request #14572 from vector-im/t3chguy/devdep
|\ \
| |/
|/|
| * d328cab5 Move dev dep to the right place
|/
*   da7550e0 Merge pull request #14552 from vector-im/dependabot/npm_and_yarn/lodash-4.17.19

Both were merged, though that's irrelevant WP:OR here from me. 92.234.32.44 geolocates to the UK. 84.250.17.211 (talk) 22:08, 24 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, 92.234.32.44 is me - didn't notice i'd been logged out. Good catch on the alt tag being incorrect; fixed in https://github.com/vector-im/riot-web/commit/f21352f55817eeee49f392405f00284ea615aef8. The fact that https://github.com/vector-im/riot-web/pull/14566 wasn't squash-merged and so technically the bad commit leaked into the repository before immediately being reverted doesn't change the fact that the commit was wrong, which is why it was reverted and fixed. Please don't let the same bug spread into Wikipedia! Marviiin (talk) 01:30, 25 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]