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Two UFO videos supposedly taken in the south of France the day after the Alderney sighting,[1][2] have been proven to be hoaxed.[3][4]. JMK (talk) 09:43, 30 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In 1995 tim edwards filmed a ufo in salida colardo that looks just like what ray described. This video is on the net and youtube. 118.208.116.32 (talk) 12:13, 28 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have tagged the article due to it being of pretty poor quality. I think the tags speak for themselves, but note that I have also started a thread on WP:FTN to discuss what to do about the cleanup that is required. jps (talk) 13:08, 13 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Tags were removed without discussion. I have included a new tag just to make sure that the problem is made abundantly clear. Even if this article survives AfD, I see no WP:FRIND sources. jps (talk) 18:05, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The sentence below has been tagged as peacocking:

According to The Times, Bowyer's report is "regarded as one of the most impressive and perplexing testimonies to have found its way into MoD archives"

WP:PEACOCK gives the following as an example of good practice to fix peacocking:

Dylan was included in Time's 100: The Most Important People of the Century, in which he was called "master poet, caustic social critic and intrepid, guiding spirit of the counterculture generation"

The edit summary from User:ජපස read "The editor in question (you?) chose this quote to highlight. Why this quote? Why not another that was less puffy?". To answer that question, reporting subjective judgements from reliable sources is a normal device to help establish a subject's notability, as well as to demonstrate to the reader why an article's subject might be of interest to them.

Per WP:BRD, I'm seeking consensus as to the proper interpretation of WP:PEACOCK here, and whether the tag should stand. UndercoverClassicist (talk) 19:34, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Or... can you explain why this particular quote ought to be included twice in this article? What makes it worthy of inclusion? jps (talk) 19:48, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It is mentioned once in the body and once in the lead. That does seem reasonable, as the lead should follow the body. It clearly merits inclusion in the article as a judgment on the case's significance published in a newspaper of record. Boynamedsue (talk) 19:53, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Who cares whether a "newspaper of record" dropped the ball with careful vetting? Did any experts weigh in? jps (talk) 21:21, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

There is a problem with User:ජපස tag-bombing on this page, as what seems to be part of an attempt to influence voting on a deletion discussion. Tagging of reliable sources such as the BBC and Evening Standard as unreliable is pretty bad. Tagging the pilot's statements as "contradictory" when they consist of direct quotations is unfathomable. This tag is intended for when the body text contradicts itself, not to highlight perceived differences between accounts of an event. This article's purpose is not to decide if these accounts are "true", but to relate what has been said about them in reliable sources. Boynamedsue (talk) 19:53, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I have removed the "does not include all significant viewpoints" tag, as I am unaware of any other viewpoints held in reliable sources that are not included. If a user is aware of any other viewpoints held on this UFO-sighting account by a reliable source which are not included in the article, they should add them. Or, alternatively, post them here and I will endeavour to add them myself. Boynamedsue (talk) 20:06, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

We're going to be on the horns of a dilemma here: multiple explanations have been discussed for this, but not in sources of the same quality as those currently used. To be specific, we're going to need to engage with David Clarke's work, as he has written and published widely on the topic: other editors have dismissed him as unreliable, though I must admit to not fully understanding the rationale for that judgement. Essentially, if we're going to insist on using the very highest of HQRS, we can't do much discussion as to attempted explanations; equally, if we're going to fully balance the article (and include some quite important details as to the events), we're going to need to include sources that have previously been controversial. My view is that those sources fit WP:HQRS and can be integrated, if used properly, but I think this conversation is best left until after AfD, particularly as some of the as-yet-unsettled points of contention at AfD are important to it. UndercoverClassicist (talk) 20:29, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, I see. So there is a secondary question of whether viewpoints can be considered reliable, and if they are, whether WP:FRINGE etc. might come into play? Boynamedsue (talk) 21:08, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

More or less: it'll be clearer to work this out when there are some concrete examples, and I'm reluctant to do the leg-work of writing them all out in present circumstances, partly for the reasons above, and partly seeing the possibility of having it all deleted. However, the present issue in AfD as to the distinction between "a source good enough to report that a claim/interpretation has been made and is notable" and "a source good enough to prove the truth of that claim" will have a substantial bearing on how many of these theories can be included. UndercoverClassicist (talk) 21:15, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]