The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was speedy keep. Withdrawn. (non-admin closure) – AssumeGoodWraith (talk | contribs) 06:24, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Magnesia (hypothetical city)[edit]

Magnesia (hypothetical city) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)

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The concept of Magnesia has no life outside of Plato's Laws. It's not like Utopia. It should just be covered in the article on Plato's Laws. I really doubt it's notable as a separate concept, especially since Laws is kind of obscure. Yellow Diamond Δ Direct Line to the Diamonds 04:41, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Withdrawn by nominator -- It will be converted into a draft, and if it doesn't turn out to be notable by itself it can be used for the Laws article.--Yellow Diamond Δ Direct Line to the Diamonds 05:31, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

See Magnesia (disambiguation) for a list of cities named after this colony, for one small example of its "life outside Plato's laws". Also, you don't know what you don't know. There is alot written about Plato's utopias; and I could find dozens of secondary sources with a simple JSTOR or even web search, and this is what I and other competent contributors will do in the coming weeks. I suggest you try that first before nominating for deletion, and move this to Draft instead. This has had a very long afterlife in 2,000 years of philosophical discussion, including in Aristotle, Augustine, and Aquinas, texts that have made western civilization what it is, for better and worse. Just because that is "obscure" to you and other editors who are unaware of the history of political philosophy, does not mean that it has "no life outside Plato's laws". Regards, Jaredscribe (talk) 05:14, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

But unless the concept has been kind of removed from Laws, isn't it better to keep the info all on the page for Laws? I have made a search on an academic database and everything is just about Laws itself. Yellow Diamond Δ Direct Line to the Diamonds 05:17, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

In some ways, yes, it will reduce need for duplication. I'd prefer if you leave it in draft for a few weeks, since I'm the only one so far editing this, and if it proves to be cumbersome, we can deprecate the article and move it into Laws.Jaredscribe (talk) 05:24, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That sounds like a good plan; I just didn't want to move it into draft space if it has no hope of becoming an independent article eventually. If it's in drafts though I think it should be fine. Yellow Diamond Δ Direct Line to the Diamonds 05:27, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

However there is precedent for leaving articles on fictional cities. For example, Plato's Atlantis and Bacon's Salomon's House. Having its own article would allow for ease of comparison. Jaredscribe (talk) 05:28, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

True, but I think Laws isn't commented on widely enough for Magnesia to have its own article. It's obscure, which isn't a good thing, but that's how it is. Yellow Diamond Δ Direct Line to the Diamonds 05:32, 15 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.