100.14.89.197 (talk) Tag: Reverted |
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Hello, please change "tageldit n lmaɣrib" to "tageldit n lmeɣrib" in the romanized version of 'the kingdom of morocco' in tamazight as it is closer to the pronunciation and also more coherent with the tamazight spelling ("ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ"(L-M-GH-R-I-B) the 'e' equivalent in tamazight is generally not used because it is implied, which is not the case of the "a", "lmaɣrib" would've been written "ⵍⵎⴰⵖⵔⵉⴱ"). I also noticed it was written correctly in its first occurence, so this would make the introduction also more coherent. Thanks in advance. [[User:Ufloe|Ufloe]] ([[User talk:Ufloe|talk]]) 22:29, 6 January 2021 (UTC) |
Hello, please change "tageldit n lmaɣrib" to "tageldit n lmeɣrib" in the romanized version of 'the kingdom of morocco' in tamazight as it is closer to the pronunciation and also more coherent with the tamazight spelling ("ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ"(L-M-GH-R-I-B) the 'e' equivalent in tamazight is generally not used because it is implied, which is not the case of the "a", "lmaɣrib" would've been written "ⵍⵎⴰⵖⵔⵉⴱ"). I also noticed it was written correctly in its first occurence, so this would make the introduction also more coherent. Thanks in advance. [[User:Ufloe|Ufloe]] ([[User talk:Ufloe|talk]]) 22:29, 6 January 2021 (UTC) |
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:{{done}} [[WP:CC-BY-SA|(CC)]] [[User:Tbhotch|<span style="color: #4B0082;">Tb</span><span style="color: #6082B6;">hotch</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Tbhotch|<big style="color: #555555;">™</big>]]</sup> 22:55, 6 January 2021 (UTC) |
:{{done}} [[WP:CC-BY-SA|(CC)]] [[User:Tbhotch|<span style="color: #4B0082;">Tb</span><span style="color: #6082B6;">hotch</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Tbhotch|<big style="color: #555555;">™</big>]]</sup> 22:55, 6 January 2021 (UTC) |
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== Controversial and undiscussed change to regional map == |
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I think it would be important to address an alarming edit made [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Morocco&diff=1004708465&oldid=1004524368 here] that was almost certainly going to go unnoticed, where an editor made an undiscussed, unwarranted and controversial change (without seeking consensus) by replacing maps and claiming his to be "neutral". In other words, he uploads a [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Administrative_Regions_of_Morocco.jpg map] that he published on Commons that isn't even 2 days old and replaces the [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tasgiwin_n_Murakuc_-_Regions_of_Morocco.png long standing version] that has been there for a significantly long time. It also removes the spelling/pronunciation for all twelve regions in their native Amazigh ("Berber"). Not only that but he also completely removed [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Morocco_de_facto_map.jpg#filelinks this map] and it's content, claiming it to be a "'''''Violation of NPOV'''''", which is ridiculous because the description clearly states the de-facto situation of areas controlled by Morocco and also the areas in grey which are occupied by the Polisario. Regarding the region map, there are 12 Administrative Regions according to the government of the Kingdom of Morocco, and all 12 all de-facto under Morocco's control, including the ones within Western Sahara. His map states that there are only 11 regions, while in fact there are twelve and even the article states it. His map does not match what the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morocco#Administrative_divisions article states here]. You should also know the editor had no problem expressing his POV [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Outline_of_Morocco&diff=1002044652&oldid=1002043707 here], using notorious language and rhetoric commonly used by the Polisario and it's sympathizers, claiming "''Morocco and what it '''illegally occupies'''", "'Morocco doesn't have a border with Mauritania and it never had. It southern border is with Western Sahara, a non-self-governing territory that is '''partly occupied by it and partly liberated by the SADR'''. ''There is nothing neutral about these new edits made, as his clear intent is to isolate Morocco from Western Sahara in any sort of map and force the presence of a solid border. If what he truly was seeking was neutrality, he could've at least adopted [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Morocco_Regions_2015_numbered.svg this map], which both shows all 12 of Morocco's Administrative Regions and its names, but also a dashed disputed border between Morocco/Western Sahara, as well as the name "Western Sahara". Instead, his version completely isolates Morocco from Western Sahara, using a solid border, as if it were its own independent country (which according to the UN, it's not), and there is absolutely nothing neutral about it, as he claimed, but purely a POV of how things should be seen, presumably from the Polisario/Algerian perspective. This should be reverted back to the [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Morocco&oldid=1004524368 stable long-standing version] , at the very least until a consensus is made. Regards. -- [[Special:Contributions/100.14.89.197|100.14.89.197]] ([[User talk:100.14.89.197|talk]]) 16:54, 5 February 2021 (UTC) |
Revision as of 16:54, 5 February 2021
![]() | Morocco was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Template:Outline of knowledge coverage
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 August 2018 and 22 December 2018. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Braelynnwilson (article contribs).
Black people
No mention or statistics given on the possible number of black people in Morocco Nlivataye (talk) 16:09, 30 September 2020 (UTC)
- There's no official statistics of how many black people live in morocco. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:46, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
Recognition
Morocco wasn't the first to recognize the United States independence neither formally nor informally. The Dutch was first informally "Sint Eustatius was the most important place for dealing or smuggling with Americans. On 16 November 1776, at the beginning of the American Revolutionary War, the American navy ship USS Andrew Doria, with the American Declaration of Independence on board, arrived in St. Eustatius. Its captain fired a salute to the Dutch flag on Fort Oranje and Johannes de Graaff decided to answer the salute with eleven gunshots. And so the United States of America were for the first time recognized as a nation by this salute of eleven guns." Bluedreambrook (talk) 09:07, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
The source is here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johannes_de_Graaff Bluedreambrook (talk) 09:08, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
- There's a huge difference between a salute and a formal recognition. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:45, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
minerals, mineral resourcing
de:Marokko#Bodenschätze (sub-section of section economy) mentions iron ore, lead, copper, zinc, silver, gold, manganese, Nickel, Cobalt and phosphor. --Präziser (talk) 20:28, 15 November 2020 (UTC)
Demande de modification semi-protégée le 10 décembre 2020
{{edit demi-protected|Morocco to Casablanca in by 2 Mars City Verdin Palace an New York Time of the Journal Wekend Time|answered=no-yes}} 21:18, 10 December 2020 UTC [refresh] 105.155.103.165 (talk) 21:18, 10 December 2020 (UTC)
- ..en anglais svp? -Roxy the inedible dog . wooF 22:15, 10 December 2020 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 11 December 2020
Morocco does not occupy the so-called western Sahara. It is part of the Kingdom of Morocco. Yesterday, the US President, Donald J. Trump, recognized the sovereignty of Morocco over Sahara. Please, Change the Map an turn it into Green as whole. I am atttaching a link below that shows the recognition of US over Moroccan Sahara
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/proclamation-recognizing-sovereignty-kingdom-morocco-western-sahara/ Abdelaaliel (talk) 21:37, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the
{{edit protected}}
template. (CC) Tbhotch™ 22:05, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 17 December 2020
Hi wiki, you have to delete western sahara from the Moroccan map, coz the news map is only morocco from Tanger city at Mauritain contry..thank u جواد الأطلس (talk) 01:22, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
- I agree it should at least include the area Morocco controls or administers. BlueLight05 (talk) 01:42, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the
{{edit semi-protected}}
template.
SSSB (talk) 10:38, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 17 December 2020 (2)
Updating the GINI index to 40.3 Source: https://read.oecd-ilibrary.org/development/africa-s-development-dynamics-2018_9789264302501-en#page18 BlueLight05 (talk) 01:40, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
Orthographic Projection
Hi, I changed the orthographic projection displayed on this page (as well as the correct description to go along with it. Sources why I made this change: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sahara https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sahara_conflict https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Provinces. I think that the projection should be updated with a clearer (more direct) view of Morocco, so if anyone can do that with this projection, that would be a big help. Thanks -EdDakhla — Preceding undated comment added 17:38, 25 December 2020 (UTC)
CIA changes map of Morocco
Hi, I just wanted to point out that the Central Intelligence Agency, one of the most highly used and reliable sources for articles in Wikipedia, has in fact changed the country map of Morocco (on 17 Dec. 2020). Given that the CIA is a highly reliable source, I formally request the revision of all (reliable) sources used to cite for the current map (and orthographic projection) of Morocco used in this article. If there are not any sources (or a majority) that contradict the new change made by the CIA, then I believe it is appropriate to present the map/projection of Morocco including the Sahara (mainly all dark green for the orthographic projection and the Koppen Climate Type map to be updated showing the Sahara). If not, I request that map should at least show the zones of W. Sahara that Morocco (not occupy) but controls (west of the Moroccan Berm Wall/coastal regions) in dark green because Polisario have zero control or influence in those parts of the territory. Thanks -EdDakhla (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:11, December 27, 2020
- The majority of sources contradict the World Factbook source, which has no special status as a reliable source. CMD (talk) 00:53, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
- I agree with CMD. While the Factbook is a reputable source, it is also a source intimately linked to U.S. foreign policy and changes in its content do not necessarily merit overarching changes in wikipedia's content without a consensus across sources. Cristiano Tomás (talk) 08:04, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
Morocco controlled/uncontrolled territory
For the orthographic map, it may be appropriate to consider showing the regions in Western Sahara that Morocco controls, like how India, China, Pakistan and other countries that have claims on regions they do not control (Morocco currently administers/controls about 80% of the territory). For almost all of the other countries that have disputed regions, lighter green represents the area that they merely claim, but not control (again, not the case for Morocco and Western Sahara because it controls ~80%). This projection shows the territory that Morocco controls in dark green, and the claimed but uncontrolled areas (SADR/buffer zone) in light green. The current map caption is also partially misleading compared to the current projection because it states it's "mostly occupied by Morocco as its Southern Provinces". These Southern Provinces are not shown in the current projection, but are in the proposed projection . Change to projection will also warrant to making some changes to the map caption, stating "dark green: territories controlled by Morocco, lighter green: claimed but uncontrolled territories", and still showing the disputed status of Western Sahara of course, or just the regular template. -EdDakhla 19:51, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- 1) Western Sahara is a non-self-governing territory that is claimed and partly occupied by Morocco.[1] 2) Showing any part of WS as an extension of Morocco would violate NPOV and be grossly misleading. See WS map and Morocco's map (according to the UN). 3) As a matter of fact, by showing the light green (as it is now), we're already giving preferential treatment to Morocco. Have a look at Israel where the Golan Heights is not shown in the infobox. M.Bitton (talk) 20:19, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- Morocco is recognized as administrative power in Western Sahara (according to the UN): «The Secretary-General shared the view of his Personal Envoy that further meetings of the parties would not succeed, and could indeed be counterproductive, unless the Government of Morocco, as administrative power of the Territory, was prepared to offer or support some devolution of authority» [2]. I think the new map would reflect de facto administred territory in which Moroccan currency and customs apply. --Flaspec (talk) 20:38, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- I agree with @Flaspec. Morocco does not "party occupy" Western Sahara, it administers most* of it. As for the Golan Heights, Israel illegally attempted to take that region from Syria, while Morocco has deep historical influence (and relatively valid claims) to Western Sahara for centuries (if you go to 'W.S.' today, the "SADR" flag is nowhere to be found, and neither is the Polisario). I'm referring to territories in which Morocco controls, west of the Moroccan Western Sahara Wall. Need I remind you that the this map of Western Sahara you presented shows the (Berm Wall) I'm talking about. Additionally, although the UN does not recognize full sovereignty of Morocco or the self proclaimed "SADR" over Western Sahara, it does recognize Morocco's administrative sovereignty. As a former resident of "Western Sahara" myself of over 17 years, I'll enlighten you that the passport, driver's license, license plates, currency, flags and all other official or government documents/ID's are of Morocco's. EdDakhla 20:46, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- Of course you agree with the editor that you canvassed.[3]
The 2002 U.N. opinion also makes clear that Morocco does not have the status of being Western Sahara’s de facto administering power, as such a status does not exist under international law.[4]
- Jacob Mundy is a scholar who has written a book about the subject. M.Bitton (talk) 20:51, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- I did not canvass or have an influence over the opinion of this editor, but simply request to explore the opportunity to show a less misleading projection map. Of course you'll cite Jacob Mundy, an author or "scholar", who you agree with and writes a book entirely from one POV. In addition to that, the Washington Post is not the UN and not a reliable source like the UN is, and that article was not viewable to people who are not subscribed members (like myself and many others). So far, a consensus has technically been made and you are the only minority objecting to this change. EdDakhla 21:06, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- You absolutely have canvassed Flaspec and I have supplied the diff to prove it. Jacob Mundy is a scholar whose job is to analyze primary sources, something we do not do. I suggest you read WP:CONSENSUS and WP:RS before jumping to conclusions. M.Bitton (talk) 21:17, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- I did not canvass or have an influence over the opinion of this editor, but simply request to explore the opportunity to show a less misleading projection map. Of course you'll cite Jacob Mundy, an author or "scholar", who you agree with and writes a book entirely from one POV. In addition to that, the Washington Post is not the UN and not a reliable source like the UN is, and that article was not viewable to people who are not subscribed members (like myself and many others). So far, a consensus has technically been made and you are the only minority objecting to this change. EdDakhla 21:06, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- I absolutely did not canvass Flaspec (I'll do you the favor of pinging him this time), as you can see here him and I have disagreements, please do not for one moment think you can try slander me to help your point of view and only bring up certain things that helps you. Jacob Mundy is a POV writer at its fine form and "Jacob Mundy is a scholar whose job is to analyze primary sources, something we do not do", no need to make assumptions of what we (or I) may or may not do, as for a fact you do not know what I do. EdDakhla 21:29, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- Slander? I am more than happy to take this to WP:ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:34, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- @M.Bitton, go ahead, take this to WP:ANI, bringing in unnecessary admin intervention maybe because you're getting upset. The claim that I "canvassed" @Flaspec is baseless because that did not happen and I've supplied the evidence to support that. Nobody has initiated a personal attack on you but if you wish, feel free to report me merely for using the discussion page. EdDakhla 21:43, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- If you don't want the admins to intervene, don't throw around baseless accusations of slander. As for Flaspec, there isn't a shred of doubt that you have canvassed them. If you think this is a baseless accusation, do the proper thing and report it to ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:50, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- @M.Bitton, done. Feel free to make your argument on that page. EdDakhla 22:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- Whether Morocco does or does not control Western Sahara is not up for you to decide. This is still up for discussion and awaiting consensus. EdDakhla 00:09, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- If we include all of Western Sahara in Morocco's area, its rank is #39. If we include none of it, its rank is #57. If we include only the 80% of it that this discussion is saying Morocco controls, then what is Morocco's rank?? Georgia guy (talk) 00:12, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Georgia guy good question. Mathematically speaking the de-facto size of Morocco is 659,350 km^2, therefore ranking it rank #40, after Myanmar which is 676,578 km^2. EdDakhla 00:33, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- If we include all of Western Sahara in Morocco's area, its rank is #39. If we include none of it, its rank is #57. If we include only the 80% of it that this discussion is saying Morocco controls, then what is Morocco's rank?? Georgia guy (talk) 00:12, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- Whether Morocco does or does not control Western Sahara is not up for you to decide. This is still up for discussion and awaiting consensus. EdDakhla 00:09, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- @M.Bitton, done. Feel free to make your argument on that page. EdDakhla 22:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- If you don't want the admins to intervene, don't throw around baseless accusations of slander. As for Flaspec, there isn't a shred of doubt that you have canvassed them. If you think this is a baseless accusation, do the proper thing and report it to ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:50, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- @M.Bitton, go ahead, take this to WP:ANI, bringing in unnecessary admin intervention maybe because you're getting upset. The claim that I "canvassed" @Flaspec is baseless because that did not happen and I've supplied the evidence to support that. Nobody has initiated a personal attack on you but if you wish, feel free to report me merely for using the discussion page. EdDakhla 21:43, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- Slander? I am more than happy to take this to WP:ANI. M.Bitton (talk) 21:34, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
- I absolutely did not canvass Flaspec (I'll do you the favor of pinging him this time), as you can see here him and I have disagreements, please do not for one moment think you can try slander me to help your point of view and only bring up certain things that helps you. Jacob Mundy is a POV writer at its fine form and "Jacob Mundy is a scholar whose job is to analyze primary sources, something we do not do", no need to make assumptions of what we (or I) may or may not do, as for a fact you do not know what I do. EdDakhla 21:29, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
Per NPOV, territory in W.S. that is controlled by Morocco must be shown (see Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic article), where Polisario territory is acknowledged in dark green (should be the same for Morocco per NPOV). Also it is not showing it as an "extension" of Morocco (POV statement) like @M.Bitton said. EdDakhla 07:06, 5 January 2021 (UTC)
- No part of Western Sahara (a non-self-governing territory) should be shown as part of Morocco as doing so would violate NPOV. M.Bitton (talk) 14:52, 5 January 2021 (UTC)
- No, that would violate YOUR POV. See the SADR article where controlled territory is acknowledged in dark green. Per NPOV, the same should be shown for Morocco. Don't revert just because one thing doesn't align with your POV, you can't have your cake and eat it too. EdDakhla 16:24, 5 January 2021 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 6 January 2021
Hello, please change "tageldit n lmaɣrib" to "tageldit n lmeɣrib" in the romanized version of 'the kingdom of morocco' in tamazight as it is closer to the pronunciation and also more coherent with the tamazight spelling ("ⵍⵎⵖⵔⵉⴱ"(L-M-GH-R-I-B) the 'e' equivalent in tamazight is generally not used because it is implied, which is not the case of the "a", "lmaɣrib" would've been written "ⵍⵎⴰⵖⵔⵉⴱ"). I also noticed it was written correctly in its first occurence, so this would make the introduction also more coherent. Thanks in advance. Ufloe (talk) 22:29, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
Controversial and undiscussed change to regional map
I think it would be important to address an alarming edit made here that was almost certainly going to go unnoticed, where an editor made an undiscussed, unwarranted and controversial change (without seeking consensus) by replacing maps and claiming his to be "neutral". In other words, he uploads a map that he published on Commons that isn't even 2 days old and replaces the long standing version that has been there for a significantly long time. It also removes the spelling/pronunciation for all twelve regions in their native Amazigh ("Berber"). Not only that but he also completely removed this map and it's content, claiming it to be a "Violation of NPOV", which is ridiculous because the description clearly states the de-facto situation of areas controlled by Morocco and also the areas in grey which are occupied by the Polisario. Regarding the region map, there are 12 Administrative Regions according to the government of the Kingdom of Morocco, and all 12 all de-facto under Morocco's control, including the ones within Western Sahara. His map states that there are only 11 regions, while in fact there are twelve and even the article states it. His map does not match what the article states here. You should also know the editor had no problem expressing his POV here, using notorious language and rhetoric commonly used by the Polisario and it's sympathizers, claiming "Morocco and what it illegally occupies", "'Morocco doesn't have a border with Mauritania and it never had. It southern border is with Western Sahara, a non-self-governing territory that is partly occupied by it and partly liberated by the SADR. There is nothing neutral about these new edits made, as his clear intent is to isolate Morocco from Western Sahara in any sort of map and force the presence of a solid border. If what he truly was seeking was neutrality, he could've at least adopted this map, which both shows all 12 of Morocco's Administrative Regions and its names, but also a dashed disputed border between Morocco/Western Sahara, as well as the name "Western Sahara". Instead, his version completely isolates Morocco from Western Sahara, using a solid border, as if it were its own independent country (which according to the UN, it's not), and there is absolutely nothing neutral about it, as he claimed, but purely a POV of how things should be seen, presumably from the Polisario/Algerian perspective. This should be reverted back to the stable long-standing version , at the very least until a consensus is made. Regards. -- 100.14.89.197 (talk) 16:54, 5 February 2021 (UTC)