Legality of Cannabis by U.S. Jurisdiction

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::Also pushing some [[WP:OR]] here [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Ganja&diff=prev&oldid=155125508] and further assumping bad faith and attempting to single me out [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Thatcher131&diff=prev&oldid=155049664 here]. [[User:Atabek|Atabek]] 08:26, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
::Also pushing some [[WP:OR]] here [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Ganja&diff=prev&oldid=155125508] and further assumping bad faith and attempting to single me out [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Thatcher131&diff=prev&oldid=155049664 here]. [[User:Atabek|Atabek]] 08:26, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
{{discussion bottom}}
{{discussion bottom}}

:::Chaser, the violation of [[WP:AGF]] reported has not been addressed. So the discussion should not be archived until another admin independently reviews the issue. [[User:Atabek|Atabek]] 17:30, 4 September 2007 (UTC)


==[[Occupations of Latvia]]==
==[[Occupations of Latvia]]==

Revision as of 17:30, 4 September 2007

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User:VartanM

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
I don't see anything particularly uncivil in the diffs presented either below or above my comment, so I'm closing this thread. If anyone is going to open further threads related to this conflict, I suggest you judiciously select the diffs you want administrators to consider and then let them consider it. Continuing the conflict by elongating a thread on this page is often a pointless exercise.--Chaser - T 16:49, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In violation of ArbCom remedy [1], assumes bad faith [2] by comment: "AdilBaguirov and the team are banned from Wikipedia...". He further expands on his assumption of bad faith [3] by saying:

  • " I don't know if Atabek considers himself part of that "team" but both of them shared similar views when both were active. If indeed Atabek considers himself part of Adil Baguirov's team its just another reason to remove it."

Please, take a note that he is also concurrently involved in an edit war at Khojaly Massacre. Thanks. Atabek 22:01, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

User:Hajji Piruz openly coordinates with User:VartanM, in removing sources and attacking another Wikipedia user [4], which also goes along ArbCom remedy violation. Atabek 22:19, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Personal web sites are sometimes acceptable as external links, but not if they are highly partisan in nature and involving extremely controversial material. (For example, the personal web site of Burt Rutan may be an acceptable external link for an article on Spaceship One, but Yassir Arafat's personal web site would not be an acceptable external link for an article on the history of Israel.) I don't see anything particularly uncivil there. Thatcher131 23:13, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Thatcher131 that there's nothing particularly uncivil here. I expect that editors will leave me talk page posts about alleged ban violations in this case (but let's not start an annoying tit-for-tat).--Chaser - T 07:17, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Chaser, what Thatcher131 was referring to was the principle whether a website can or cannot be included as external link. The issue I report is the assumption of bad faith by User:VartanM, that User:AdilBaguirov has a team, and I am its member. That's a clear-cut violation of WP:AGF, and I expect a response on that subject. Whether AdilBaguirov's website should or should not be included, that is a separate content subject, which was addressed by Thatcher131 above. Thanks. Atabek 07:35, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

How about blatant bad faith assumption here: [5] I beleive admins might be interested in considering comments like: Ironically, had she been an ancient Armenian queen, our Azeri friends here would have insisted that she was non-Armenian. (And I am not saying you guys are doing it in bad faith--I am sure you fully believe you are improving the quality of Wikipedia while disrupting Armenian articles. I am merely making an observation on a well established pattern of edits). Accusations of disrupting "Armenian articles" are far from this principle, declared by the latest arbcom: [6] Grandmaster 07:58, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I must also note a bad faith assumption right here on this page by User:VartanM: [7] --Grandmaster 08:04, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Also pushing some WP:OR here [8] and further assumping bad faith and attempting to single me out here. Atabek 08:26, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Chaser, the violation of WP:AGF reported has not been addressed. So the discussion should not be archived until another admin independently reviews the issue. Atabek 17:30, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Occupations of Latvia

The article Occupations of Latvia has been placed on probation over a long pattern of various disruption. During the recent months, largely thanks to new, previously non-involved editors such as Termer, the article has been severely overhauled. Recently, it passed Wikipedia peer review with no major content problems found.

However, Irpen and Grafikm_fr have engaged in a campaign of developing artificial controversy over this article's compliability with Wikipedia standards. It's all the more insidious that both have refused -- not merely neglected -- to provide any specifics of the non-compliance issues proposed; see Talk:Occupations of Latvia#Suggestions for improvement for details. Despite refusal to actually cite compliance issues, both have reinstated the {{noncompliant}} tag ([9], [10]) after it was removed following the consensus developed on the article's talk page. Such behaviour is clearly disruptive, and there's currently a discussion on Talk:Vandalism going on over whether it can also be classified as vandalism.

According to the arbitration decision:


I'm requesting administrative intervention to enforce the arbitration decision in an appropriate manner. Digwuren 20:32, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed attention to this article is warranted. Objections to its condition remain not addressed despite their being described at talk multiple times and in detail. The editor above dares to revert war on the article on probation, repeatedly removing a well-epxlained tag. Feel free to join the discussion and enforce the ArbCom's decision. --Irpen 20:43, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Irpen refuses to explicitly articulate what those objections are and continues to claim the old discussions regarding the old article are still applicable. However the article was extensively revised and subject to peer review since then. This approach of tagging while being evasive about the reasons is disruptive to building a good article Martintg 21:05, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Response It appears that the one of the main concerns originally identified by the Arbitrators, namely whether the Soviet presence in Latvia was an occupation, and whether—regardless of the answer to the first question—the article's current title and scope are appropriately chosen has not been addressed by the recent re-write. The question of whether to identify the Soviet presence in Latvia as an "occupation" or something else is a problem that is not confined to this article, see obviously Occupation of Baltic states among others. I am not pursuaded by the alleged peer review, to whom the only contributor seems to have been javascript that analyzes grammatical and style issues. Therefore I am not convinced that Grafikm_fr and Irpen are creating an artificial controversy. I suggest that the editors engage Irpen and Grafikm_fr in a discussion to determine whether, as a matter of editorial judgement, it is acceptable to refer to the Soviet presence as an occupation, and whether, as a matter of editorial judgement, the three phases of occupation should be described in 3, 2 or one article. I also suggest that comments be solicited in a neutrally-worded way from the RFC process, the admins' noticeboard, and even the Village Pumps, to obtain a significant outside comments on these issues and a more meaningful peer review than a grammar bot. I ask Grafikm_fr and Irpen to provide meaningful feedback and suggestions on how the article might be split and especially on how to refer to the 1945-1991 period. If after one week significant progress is not being made on these issues please make a new report to Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Arbitration enforcement. Thatcher131 23:39, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

User:Hetoum I

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
Result: blocked for 24 hours. Thatcher131 23:03, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

According to the remedy #2 of the recent arbcom case Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Armenia-Azerbaijan 2, the admins can place any editor who edits articles which relate to Armenia-Azerbaijan and related ethnic conflicts in an aggressive point of view manner marked by incivility on revert parole and other limitations, established by the arbcom. Please see [11]

Hetoum I (talk · contribs) was placed by the admin under the remedy #2, which includes revert parole, limiting him to 1 rv per week. [12] This was logged here: [13]

However, on the article House of Hasan-Jalalyan Hetoum I made 2 reverts within 1 week, deleting sourced info: [14] [15] This is clearly a violation of the revert parole Hetoum was placed on. Grandmaster 07:11, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hetoum I repeated the same violation on Karabakh khanate, making two rvs within 1 day: [16] [17] Grandmaster 07:16, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Another violation on Khurshidbanu Natavan: [18] [19] Grandmaster 07:23, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I will call this report as misleading for the lack of better words
Hetoum is being accused for violating 1RR on House of Hasan-Jalalyan whats misleading about this is that the first revert was on August 28 and Hetoum was warned on August 29, further misleading is that Hetoum was removing irrelevant information added by Grandmaster. Atabek and Grandmaster both reverted once and are now out of revertes for a week. Grandmaster apperantly decided to spam this page.
For Karabakh khanete there is no substantial proof that it was an Azerbaijani khanete and therefore the category was removed.
The other "violation" is on Khurshidbanu Natavan where Hetoum removed this picture and the text that accompanied. The picture was being considered as a source for a lengthy POV section to attack Armenians. Grandmaster reverted Hetoum saying (do not remove sourced info). How is that picture sourcing this info?? So you see Grandmater did nothing but mislead you. VartanM 16:32, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
It is simply a fact that he made his second rv on House of Hasan-Jalalyan after being placed on a parole, therefore it is a violation. The same with other two instances reported here. Regardless of content issues (where Hetoum was making POV edits, btw), he made 2 rvs in less than 1 week. Therefore Hetoum is in violation of his parole. Grandmaster 16:47, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Unless it's obvious vandalism, revert parole is revert parole. - Penwhale | Blast him / Follow his steps 20:56, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • Notification appears to have been sufficient [20] so blocked for 24 hours. Thatcher131 22:53, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:Atabek

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
Atabek has been banned from the Armenia-Azerbaijani topic area for 4 days, enforceable by blocks. New reports should be made in a new section. Thatcher131 22:59, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The user is under civility parole under Armenia-Azerbaijan 2 case. He repeatedly accused me of being immoral in Khojaly Massacre talkpage --VartanM 21:55, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

VartanM, please, provide the diff, where I said "you're immoral". I said, I have a question about the moral stance of an individual trying to remove the picture of massacred Azeri children from Khojaly Massacre page, while insisting on recognition of Armenian Genocide. What kind of recognition or sympathy can there be to one cause, if it's only insisted upon national lines? Thanks. Atabek 10:46, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The difs are provided below. You repeatedly implied that I have no morals. Just for your information I never tried to remove the said picture, only the link to youtube videos. which were in violation of WP:Youtube. I return you attacked my personality by calling me immoral. --VartanM 16:34, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Ditto, this user has been ratcheting up the rhetoric left and right, trying to get a rise out of ethnic tensions by implying that some of the users are intolerant or racist in their editing and opening up a new front on nationalist grounds on Wikipedia.--Marshal Bagramyan 23:03, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
MarshallBagramyan, perhaps, since you claim your actions are not "intolerant or racist", why this image [21] should be removed, and another Azeri image is being removed by you while this image [22] uploaded by you currently appears on Nagorno-Karabakh War page? Don't you think the dichotomy here is rather driven by nationalist sentiments? Atabek 10:52, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Uh, HUH? Dare I ask where did you get the "nationalist" view from?... I personally think that all of you need to cool down and then come back to this. - Penwhale | Blast him / Follow his steps 11:00, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Don't you think that insertion of victim images from one side of conflict, while persistent edit warring and writing lines of discussions, reports for the purpose of removal of victim images of the other side, is driven by nationalist sentiment? In fact, this sentiment now started attacking Georgian contributors as well - [23].I would love not to waste time on these discussions and provocations, and continue editing articles, but I am not the one who started this thread on AE. Atabek 12:26, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
User:Pocopocopocopoco is not Armenian as far I know. Hes contributions are mostly on Georgian separatist states Osetia and Abkhazia and he happens to edit Nagorono-Karabakh articles once in a while. Atabeks accusations that User:Pocopocopocopoco is driven by nationalist sentiment are nothing more than WP:BITE. And it is true that he was wikistalked to Khojaly massacre by User:Iberieli whom never before edited any Nagorono-Karabakh related article. --VartanM 01:47, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

He's actually in violation of number of Principles

  • 1 Negotiation
  • 4 Consensus
  • 5 Wikipedia is not a battleground
  • 7 Courtesy
  • 8 Assume good faith
  • 10 Diplomacy
  • 14 Provocation
  • 17 Users national background and neutrality

He's also in violation of Remedies

1 fail to maintain a reasonable degree of civility in their interactions with one another concerning disputes which may arise.

2 shall apply to any editor who edits articles which relate to Armenia-Azerbaijan and related ethnic conflicts in an aggressive point of view manner marked by incivility.

Its very hard for me to Assume good faith while the user keeps attacking me. VartanM 23:17, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In discussion at Talk:Khojaly Massacre, User:VartanM is being incivil [24], and wrongfully accusing me of "personal attack" [25]. I believe his attempts to remove externally linked videos, as well as continuous attempts by User:Pocopocopocopoco - [26] to remove the image of Azeri children victims of Khojaly Massacre from the page, and attempts by User:MarshallBagramyan to purge Wikipedia image of Azeri girl from Shusha in traditional dressing at Shusha are assumptions of bad faith and engagement in battle along national lines. Doing so while arguing otherwise on the verifiability of images claimed to be related to Armenian Genocide (which were never touched or questioned), are nothing more than violations of WP:AGF and WP:SOAP. While ArbCom decision has clearly stated the requirements for editing in good faith within the limits of civility, User:VartanM and User:MarshallBagramyan, joined by User:Pocopocopocopoco are engaged only in removing images they don't like from the relevant pages or disruptively attacking contributors.
I would also like to thank User:Thatcher131 for his conclusion [27] on the issue of the image of massacred Azeri children, which should address the questions User:VartanM may have. Thanks. Atabek 11:12, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know about any arbitration but regretfully I have to agree with User:VartanM and User:MarshallBagramyan about user:Atabek's assumption of bad faith, lack of courtesy and diplomacy, as well as his engaging in WP:BITE. I made a good faith edit removing an image that had an extremely questionable source and which Administrator Francis Tyers had himself removed earlier and user:Atabek assumed bad faith and accused me of fueling conflict, insulting Azeris, and engaging in war along national lines [28]. I'm not sure which national lines Atabek is talking about though. - Pocopocopocopoco 03:23, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Atabek keeps accusing me of being incivil, what he's forgetting to mention is that, I only repeated what he said about himself that his not an expert. Also note the WP:Personal Attack (Implies that I have not moral) and the WP:SOAP(Armenian Genocide pictures). Here he again questions my morals and accuses me of being racist against Azeri. Also he questions the pictures of Armenian Genocide (in the above comment he says that it was never questioned) He further Soapboxes by denying the Armenian Genocide as a genocide. May I also remind you that Atabek went on a genocide denying spree and changed the term genocide to massacre from a dozen of articles [29]. He again calls me Immoral and accuses me of waring along national lines, while all I did was ask him to follow Wikipedia policies. Here he again calls the Armenian Genocide a massacre in early 20th century and claims that the Khojaly Massacre was no different then the Armenian Genocide. Anybody who has a basic knowledge about Armenia, Azerbaijan and Turkey would know that the two are in no way the same thing. I believe he was trying to provoke me. Keeps telling me to calm down, while I was perfectly calm and didn't answer his provocations to get me angry. In 8 months that I have been a wikipedian,I I am yet to have a conversation with Atabek without being attacked. would like to conclude by thanking Thatcher131 for explaining the WP:External Links to Atabek. VartanM 03:39, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The above users have tried to remove an image from the article about Khojaly massacre, but admin explained that the image shall remain: [30] I must also note that Pocopocopocopoco is being suspected by an admin to be a sock: [31] and he has made highly questionable edits to Khojaly massacre article, where he encountered Atabek. And I don't see any serious personal attacks on part of Atabek on anyone posting evidence here. Grandmaster 05:53, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I said what about the image? Better read it again. Thatcher131 06:41, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I meant that you said that the image could not be deleted from the article for copyright infringement, as certain users claimed. You recommended to take the issue elsewhere if they believe that copyright has been violated. --Grandmaster 06:50, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that attempts by User:Pocopocopocopoco, User:VartanM, now with support of User:MarshallBagramyan, to get rid of the image on Khojaly Massacre, which clearly exposes the savagery with which those children were massacred, are nothing other than attempts to start another war which leads straight to ArbCom. They know absolutely well that these actions may cause counter reactions on unverified images on a number of "Armenian Genocide"-related pages, hence starting another war along national lines. Users clearly try to engage in WP:BATTLE and push their WP:POV, other than contributing to the articles in a non-disruptive fashion. And I refuse to be engaged in their provocations. Atabek 10:39, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]


  • ALL of you need to take a step back and relax. Arbitrations ended just a few days ago and you guys are at it again. *sighs* - Penwhale | Blast him / Follow his steps 11:01, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Panwhale, I appreciate you trying to calm everybody down, but its very hard to be calm, when your morals are questioned and implied that you're immoral. It's further frustrating that the administrators are choosing to ignore rather then deal with this. Perhaps its time for Atabek to stop pointing fingers every time he does something wrong and face the consequences of his actions. --VartanM 16:51, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]


Respectfully Penwhale, I know nothing about any arbitration and I am relaxed. I will drop this matter in it's entirety if user:Atabek and user:Grandmaster stop biting, behave in a civil matter, keep an open mind about reliable sources and neutrality in Khojaly Massacre, and they stop trying to pile on in another case that they know very little about merely because they disagree with me about Khojaly Massacre. I only speak for myself on this issue. Pocopocopocopoco 02:57, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]


Doesn't miss the chance to WP:SOAP the Administrators Notice board with Armenian Genocide pictures. [32] VartanM 16:15, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Oh for crying out loud, your edits and comments are provocative in nature and are the crux of why these problems keep rising. "which clearly exposes the savagery with which those children were massacred", VartanM, nor I, are the one here who are resorting to these demagogic and crass accusations. Every single edit that you disagree with is met with a revert and the banal repetitive accusation that we are trying to "cover up the truth."--Marshal Bagramyan 20:00, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I've warned Atabek here that future uncivil comments (drop a note on my talk page) will result in a one week ban/block. The first comment was before the ArbCom remedy was finalized, so while technically inapplicable, the remedy was clearly coming and won't permit anyone slack in the future.--Chaser - T 19:57, 2 September 2007 (UTC) I forgot something I'd read in the thread after reading a bunch of other things. I have instituted a four-day ban, which I will enforce by block if necessary.--Chaser - T 20:10, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Chaser, thanks for taking the time and understanding the situation. I just want to add more evidence on Atabeks disruptions.
Here asks the arbitrators to place everyone involved in the AA2 case on 1RR limitation. Which is a WP:AGF violation, also principal #8 of the AA2.
Here He declares that Yelena Boner is Armenian and removes the information from the article based on that. Violation of principal #2 of the AA2
Here He threatens to wikiretaliate on Armenian Genocide pictures. The rest of his message is violation of the AA2 principals #1, #5, #7, #8, #10, #14, #17 --VartanM 02:18, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I see no violation with proposing general revert parole on all Armenia – Azerbaijan related articles. It is not a bad faith assumption, it is good faith attempt to resolve the problems with topic related articles. Me and other users were proposing the same during the first and second arbcom, as users not restricted by parole take advantage of the situation and revert legitimate edits of paroled users without any fear of punishment, which leads to further escalation of the situation. As for Bonner, she is indeed Armenian and cannot be used as a reliable source on NK related articles. This is a content dispute, and removal of this source was justified. As for "wikiretaliation", Atabek never did anything of the kind, he just pointed out that many pictures uploaded by those who tries to delete the image from Khojaly massacre article have similar copyright issues. Grandmaster 06:10, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Grandmaster did you suddently became a arbitrator and we didn't know about it? because you answer as if you were one. It is up to the arbitrators to judge whether Atabek violated any of the rules. I'm not saying that you can't defend him, because I intend to defend Hetoum I in just a little bit. As for Yelena Bonner, she is not Armenian, her step-father was. If we are to consider her to be Armenian then Steve Jobs is also Armenian. And for her reliability you need to read the AA2 principals, its #2 on the list. As for wikiretaliation he never did so, but was threating to do it which in itself is a hostile behavior and is very disruptive. VartanM 15:58, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I do not want to get too involved here, but for the record, Atabek has, in the past, threatened Wiki-retaliation also:

  1. "Then we should prepare a collage picture of Adolf Hitler with Swastika and images of Holocaust and post it on all Iran related pages"[33]
  2. "I am working on Pan-Aryan collage meanwhile. Thanks."[34]

The instance VartanM points out is not the first time he has done such a thing. I just thought that this should be mentioned. Thanks.Hajji Piruz 16:13, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

By comparing Armenian Genocide with Khojaly massacre on his userpage is trying to start a war along national lines. I believe thats a violation of his 4 day block. [35] --VartanM 21:01, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I would like to ask User:VartanM to provide an explanation proving that my user page incites a conflict? The edit is completely within the rules of WP:USER and does not violate ArbCom decision. Also, User:VartanM has been incivil here, and falsely accused me of "personal attack" here [36]. I expect a non-selective application of ArbCom decisions to all involved editors. Atabek 21:09, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

WP:USER states, under the Inappropriate content section:

There is broad agreement that you may not include in your user space material that is likely to bring the project into disrepute, or which is likely to give widespread offense. Wikipedia is not a soapbox is usually interpreted as applying to user space as well as the encyclopedia itself. You do have more latitude in user space than elsewhere, but remember: don't be a dick about it. Extremely offensive material may be removed on sight by any editor.

I'm sure that questioning of the Armenian Genocide counts as widespread offense.

Furthermore, Atabek has just come out of his block and has already started making bad faith assumptions regarding other users. Here is an example: [37].Hajji Piruz 21:16, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see how anyone was offended on my page, neither do I see any questioning of any genocides in my edit. Can you please, detail your reasoning with reference to particular wording used on the page. Also, would be interesting to know how your response comes within 15 minutes of User:VartanM, while both of you are involved in reverting warring on (Azerbaijan-Iran-Turley-Armenia) topic-related articles, targetting the same user with assumptions of bad faith, and were both ArbCom participants restricted from doing so. Atabek 21:34, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The above comment is a clear violation of "assume good faith" by Atabek. I need not say anything more regarding this issue, I have said everything that I felt needed to be said and will not involve myself here anymore. Hope the administrators comment regarding the above posts soon. Thanks.Hajji Piruz 21:40, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Please, check the history of edits by User:Hajji Piruz - [38]. They include no other topics than those related to politics, ethnicity or conflicting issues related to Azerbaijan-Armenia-Iran. Also removals of sourced material: [39], [40], assumptions of bad faith [41], and coordinating with User:VartanM to attack another Wikipedia contributor [42]. Thanks. Atabek 22:16, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe I edit Iran-Armenia-Azerbaijan historical, political, and ethnicity articles because those are the fields that I am interested in, doesnt that seem plausible? You continuously fail to assume good faith, and this is the single greatest set back to resolving the issues. You continually make up false and misleading accusations, and you continue with your aggressive editing. You have just recently come out of a block and the first things you do is make several reverts (and then revert your own reverts), make assumptions of bad faith, and attack other users.
What sourced information did I remove? I removed the Safavids from the List of Turkic states and empires because of an agreement reached on List of Iranian states and Empires. And the second diff, on Ethnic minorities in Azerbiaijan, I actually added more information. Contrary to what you may think, telling another user that he cannot put his or her assumption on sourced material is not in violation of WP:AGF in any way shape or form, its simply reminding them that we, as users, are not allowed to put our own interpretations on what scholars say.
What was the point of the arbcom we just had? It was meant to calm down the situation. Now your newest claim is that I am coordinating with VartanM simply because I agreed with him that Adil Baguirovs (User:AdilBaguirov is a blocked Wikipedia user) very own person website should not be used on Wikipedia? Ridiculous accusation and a huge violation of WP:AGF.Hajji Piruz 22:34, 3 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:Matthead and User:Poeticbent.

I submit the following diffs from the late controversy at Talk:Free City of Kraków. They are about equally from the two users at the head of this page; other users grew heated at the discussion, but largely through provocation by one of these two; and one of the others has recognized that he should not have, on my talkpage. This entire exchange would seem to be contrary to the requests for 'reasonable and calm behaviour" at Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Piotrus; and I have not quoted everything. I intentionally list one German and one Pole; we should preserve the balance between the factions. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 20:32, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]


User:Pmanderson who requested Arbitration enforcement against me has been actively involved in content dispute regarding article mentioned above and in spite of my repeated pleas, continued to make derogatory comments about me all the way through till the end of his failed request to rename the article.[43]
I submit the following comments against me, made by User:Pmanderson for your consideration.
Also, please note that a number of examples cited above by User:Pmanderson are several months old, hardly acceptable in the face of the recent Eastern European amnesty decision by the ArbCom.
My comments on examples provided by PMAnderson
  • The first example from seven and a half months ago, refers to a heated debate regarding a different subject. To bring it here, after the amnesty declared by ArbCom, is a clear proof of defiance by Septentrionalis PMAnderson.
  • The next two examples originate with Matthead.
  • The following edit was made as of 19:19, 12 January 2007, again, seven and a half months ago, about a baiting comment made by Matthead that disregarded Polish historical drive for independence.
  • User:Pmanderson's next comment seemingly based in WP:NCGN was a clear misrepresentations of policy, and if it was to be taken literally, it would indicate that the place called Cracow doesn't exist anymore.
  • [44] User Septentrionalis PMAnderson repeated the same comment twice in a survey, above and below my vote, claiming that is was a "red herring". His aggressive repetition of the same statement sounded like a warning and had a threatening look to it. Meanwhile, his supporter, Charles, wrote next to him about my vote: "grievously misleading or misunderstood interpretations of the conventions." In fact, following the vote, User Charles only intensified his personal attack on me in support of abusive comments by Septentrionalis PMAnderson, making me feel swarmed by the two of them. Please read the list of fantastic accusations by User Charles right under my refutation. The user has no business commenting here, yet feels compelled to continue his harassment.
  • [45] Please read for yourself my comment at Talk:Free City of Kraków. User Septentrionalis PMAnderson is attempting (above) to make me sound wrong by interpreting my message contrary to its spirit. The User supports his claim with a statement by an unsuspecting editor who since asked Pmanderson to have his diff removed from the above.[46]
  • And one more baiting comment by Septentrionalis PMAnderson about me, quote: "contestant for the least constructive editor award", etc.[47]
Thank you for your consideration. --Poeticbent talk 06:14, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]


  • Admin response Obviously someone who is involved in a dispute can make a report here, it is the job of admins reading this page to attempt to decide if the complaint is legitimate or not. Unfortunately there are no enforceable remedies in that case, so even if one or more users have ignored the advice to play nice, there is nothing that can be done from this board. General blocks for incivility or just being a dick can be requested at WP:ANI. or you can ask ArbCom to review the case and apply new remedies. Thatcher131 02:09, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]


My comments
I know this is coming after the admin response, but I must say that I was driven to respond to PoeticBent's behaviour each and every time because I did find it to be grievously misleading, disruptive, uncivil and just plain rude. I don't feel that PoeticBent has observed WP:NPOV, WP:POINT, WP:OWN, WP:CIVIL, WP:UE, WP:NCGN because he simply does not feel like it. Such behaviour obviously causes stress for all editors and makes it incredibly difficult for anyone to keep their cool. I truly feel that Pmanderson was not trying to make feel PoeticBent wrong because PoeticBent was wrong. The twisting and manipulation can be observed on the talk page and it is not Pmanderson doing it. The clear misrepresentations are all on the part of PoeticBent to obviously achieve a bias, which is disheartening for the quality of Wikipedia. I find most of PoeticBent's "dispute resolution" methods to be inflammatory and chiefly for the purpose of insulting the intelligence of others. Also, I found PoeticBent removing other individuals' comments to be entirely inappropriate. PoeticBent is not a censor and has no right to be.
Matthead, of course, is wrong, very wrong. The fact that he supported the move to the correct title using Cracow and then moved the Grand Duchy article to an entirely German form makes absolutely no sense to me whatsoever. I think that is all I need to say on the matter. Charles 07:45, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The above statement by User Charles is yet another example of his personal attacks on me following his failed attempt to rename the article. Please read my refutation to accusations by User Septentrionalis PMAnderson for particulars about corresponding harassment by Charles. --Poeticbent talk 15:44, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sorry to say, but PoeticBent can best be described as one who shifts blame. Charles 17:21, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Please stop the swarming, you two. There must be a better way. Septentrionalis PMAnderson abuse was directed at me if one follows the thread. No denying it now. --Poeticbent talk 17:36, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Again, shifting blame, swarming, etc, etc. Own up to your transgressions some time? I wholly believe that PB's behaviour has been entirely discourteous, a little at first but extremely so later, from the point I first disagreed with him on the talk page, if not earlier. To me, the fact that PB had to significantly augment his posting here to include his thoughts on me speaks to the fact that he feels he can continually be discourteous with one hand and wrongfully try to discredit someone with the other. The fact that PB says that he feels cornered but owns up to none of his poor actions and the fact that PB insists that it's just other people insulting him is wholly ridiculous. PoeticBent, consider for a moment that I am not Pmanderson's supporter because I like him or whatever, I'm agreeing with him because he's right, you're wrong and you have spoken out contrary to so many conventions it's not funny. I would have said what I said regardless of whether Pmanderson had said anything or not. Anyone who can read the naming conventions without a bias to hide would do so. I have every amount of business to comment here. Like the articles you insist being named the way it suits you, read WP:OWN. I can disagree with people, but I also do not stand by when someone else thinks that I'm stupid and can be convinced that naming conventions don't say what the text spells out. I still cannot believe that you see it fit to call out shots, insult others, accuse them of swarming you, etc. All of these delusions. Unreal. People tend to address problems as they see them. Are we to stand by while you have your way with whatever you want? Charles 17:43, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I deplore Poeticbent's removal of my comments. I repeat them for the record; but unless some admin disagrees with Thatcher131, and feels that the ArbCom decision does encourage action short to returning to them, this is moot.

  • The quotation from Kipling was not addressed to him, as the diff will show, it was to Ulla, whose edit it is attached to; the "sloth and heathen folly" is self-deprecation on behalf of all anglophones.
  • I went out of my way not to indicate any editor as least constructive, and I still am not sure which was. Unless Poeticbent obviously has the worst record, this is not an attack on him. Is he claiming that he has?
  • And it would be civil of Poeticbent to comply with our customs, wouldn't it? Septentrionalis PMAnderson 17:18, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

User:Hajji Piruz

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
I concur with GRBerry in this instance Thatcher131 01:56, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

User:Hajji Piruz (formerly User:Azerbaijani) has been restricted by the 1RR/week parole per ArbCom decision. He has recently violated his parole at Azerbaijan.

Version reverted to: 11:14, 22 August 2007, note the controversial point: "The name Azerbaijan was chosen as the name for what later became the Republic of Azerbaijan in 1918 by the Musavats for political reasons", which Hajji Piruz was trying to reinsert in reverts below.

  • Second Partial Revert: 05:55, 27 August 2007 - removing another source, citation of the author, and partially resinserting the same quote again: "The name Azerbaijan was chosen as the name for what later became the Republic of Azerbaijan in 1918 by the Musavats"

Interestingly, the user has been inactive for few days, and his first edit after coming back is yet another revert. Atabek 07:09, 27 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Can you not once make a report without it being completely incorrect? Also, please assume good faith. You not assuming good faith is a complete setback to the issues of the arbcom. Read the terms of the parole, reverting anonymous vandalism is an exception to the rule, and as the first revert clearly shows, the anonymous user simply came to remove sourced information which is vandalism.Hajji Piruz 22:15, 28 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Weren't you removing the sourced text here [48]? Please, assume good faith. I don't see how reporting disruptive editing would be an assumption of bad faith. Atabek 03:07, 29 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Compromising and gaining consensus often requires using part of text A and part of text B when two texts are proposed for a section. The "Second Partial Revert" is at least as well described as an attempt at compromise as it is as a "revert"; I choose to disregard it completely on that basis. Seek compromise and consensus always. GRBerry 18:49, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:Skinny McGee

As a result of Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Midnight_Syndicate, Skinny_McGee is barred from editing any articles related to Midnight Syndicate or Nox Arcana.

  • Skinny McGee has broken his ban on 3 occasions and exhibits a strong (or at the very least suspicious) bias toward any editor who mentions the name of the former band member, Joseph Vargo, for whom Skinny McGee holds a strong aversion, as indicated in his past when calling the person a "dispicable human being." [49] It was this contempt for his former band member and efforts at self-promotion for his band Midnight Syndicate that resulted in an edit war, and resulted in the ban in the first place. This could be Wikistalking in its infancy steps.
  • Skinny McGee adding a promotional link [50] to Midnight Syndicate. Skinny McGee was suspected to be a member of that band, which was part of the reason the ban was placed.
  • Removal of content (twice) from the Nox Arcana's Darklore Manor album[51] and[52]. Skinny McGee was previously found to be biased against Joseph Vargo, who is the frontman for Nox Arcana, and former producer of Midnight Syndicate. Again, this is the reason for the ban above.
  • Lobbying to Prevent further investigation into references that relate to Midnight Syndicate album credentials [53]
  • Wrongful allegations by Skinny McGee against User:Ebonyskye about what was posted. Ebonyskye never posted what Skinny McGee accused (he accused Ebonyskye of saying that Midnight Syndicate "copied" someone). Ebonyskye only defined an album that "inspired" Midnight Syndicate.[54]. The part about the band's being "similar" was already in the article posted by another user.[55]
  • Skinny McGee also complains of an item referring to his band's former producer [56] however, the post is cited and validated. Skinny McGee also complained that this post qualified as reason to block Ebonyskye. The post was not biased in any way, it was also supported and even lengthened by another user later[57] and remains.
  • Due to the complaints inaccurately reported to admins by Skinny McGee as something they were not, Ebonyskye was indeed blocked for 48 hours. According to User:Thatcher131 who blocked Ebonyskye, "I am reasonably convinced that Skinny McGee is, or is associated with, Edward Douglas."[58] (Edward Douglas being a member of Midnight Syndicate).
  • Skinny McGee did NOT notify Ebonyskye of his displeasure of the edits that Ebonyskye made and did not report to Ebonyskye's page anything in regard to the request for block, giving Ebonyskye no opportunity to reply.
  • Thatcher131 has refused to block Skinny McGee and cites a VERY unstable reason for not unblocking Ebonyskye... that being that an IP is "similar" or in the "vicinity" of another older user. That in addition to Skinny McGee's slanted report against Ebonyskye, conspired to cause an uneccessary block of Ebonyskye.
  • Ebonyskye requested a review of the block, and it was summarily done (within 09 seconds of the request)[59] which means that no "review" was actually done at all. Thatcher131 exhibited some bias in his refusal to consider this mistake.

I request a punitive temporary block of User:Skinny McGee for 1) breaking his ban as per Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Midnight_Syndicate and 2) causing undo strife and confusion in regard to making false reports. Thanks. Ebonyskye 04:02, 25 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Note to interested admins: Be sure to read User_talk:Ebonyskye/Archive1. Thatcher131 04:09, 25 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I edited the link given by Thatcher131 to point to my archived talk page, as it includes a contents directory to make finding my points easier. Ebonyskye 20:51, 26 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I just found out about this, a past Check User report about many alias' of Skinny McGee. Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Skinny_McGee. I'm not sure what it all means but it seems rather suspicious that he would try to lay blame on me for only one edit when he has all this other stuff going on. Ebonyskye 06:26, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

That report appears to be from before the arbitration case started. Newyorkbrad 02:09, 31 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't matter when that report was done. I just think is shows a pattern of suspicious behavior that has gone unpunished in the past, and it just seems to be allowed to continue while no one here has even made an attempt to look into the false claims that Skinny McGee made against me. He/she claims I wrote things that I did not write! He/she links to things that were previously posted that I only tweeked a little bit, to make something more concise or to add a date. That kind of thing. Then he/she gets me blocked because the admins looking at the "report" made by Skinny McGee do not bother to actually investigate the links any further back than my edit. I will not let this go. I really want my name cleared and the actual guilty party punished for editing on articles he was previously banned from, and it seems for good reason. Ebonyskye 00:10, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Arbitration_enforcement&diff=155664322&oldid=155657101